1969 Cadillac DeVille Project

[R Simone]

One day late last June I told my wife I thought I would drive out from NE Indiana to upstate NY to "just look at" a 1969 Deville that had been sitting most of the last twenty years that I had been talking with a gentleman about.  "When?" she said, "Today... I'm going to see if the two youngest kids want to go along and we'll stop to see Niagara Falls".  She is a car gal herself and knew good and well that my intentions went deeper than just "taking a look", but a trip to the Falls, some haggling back and forth, some explaining about what a deal it was    and a trailer ride home here she is just as I got her, being delivered July 9th of last year.

[Cadman-iac]

  Very nice looking Cadillac. From the two pictures you posted, it looks to be in very good condition. The only thing I can see is what looks like a piece of duct tape on the front of the top.
 Of the 60's cars, that's my favorite year. Had one many moons ago, white on white with a blue interior.
 Congratulations on your new to you car.

 Rick

[R Simone]

Good eye on the tape Rick!  She's actually at the upholstery shop now getting her new top that they've been holding since April. 

I took a month or so getting her road worthy last summer - new tires, battery, tune-up etc. and I couldn't believe how well it ran.  The plan was to start digging a bit deeper over the winter and have it ready by April, but in a terrible turn of events the mechanic freshening the engine up actually damaged it, and very long story short I'm going to miss this summer and have been sulking around.

I figured since I couldn't drive her I could at least post some pictures and log the upcoming engine rebuild etc. This is the second project of this type I've done - The first being a 1968 IH Scout years ago so this is a very different animal.

She's a straight "Driver" and I sure missed out on her this summer after getting a brief taste last year.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

G'day Richard,

I thought it best to contact you with relation to the race tape across your roof/windscreen.

i had a similar thing happen to me when I purchased my '72 Eldorado back in 2007.  The water leaked into the car whilst driving, so after tightening the seal across the header bar, the leak was still there.   I finally stopped it leaking by putting the tape across the top of the windscreen to the top and was going to replace the seal when I got the car home.

What I found was the water was coming in, under the windscreen stainless steel moulding, and running down the inside of the glass.   So, the screen had to come out and be resealed.

Well, when the screen was removed, the problem turned out to be that the windscreen frame that the glass sealer attaches to was rusted away.   Hopefully, yours is not the same.

Bruce.

[R Simone]

Ouch.  I didn't notice any water coming in at the windshield the time or two I got caught in the rain last summer, but the header bow was rusted so that will be replaced, along with the seals between the front & rear windows.

[R Simone]

Finally got her back from the top guy a few weeks ago and he did a great job, also cleaned up the frame when the top was off and installed some new window seals (she's been in a pole barn the last couple months and is filthy).  Last night we FINALLY moved her into my friends shop/pulled the hood and today we start pulling the engine!

[R Simone]

I am curious how to determine if it's the original power plant/nostalgic about the history of the car. I took a pic of the block casting # which is 1486238 which according to another thread does denote a 69/69 472, but is there a way to know if it's original to the car? I do have what I call the "line set ticket" but honestly it was hard for me to decipher and I don't remember seeing anything about engine #'s on it.  It will never be a show car, but I'm curious about this and if there's a way to track it down to the original selling dealer?  (The last guy had kind of fallen out of love with her and was for the most part parked 20 years and he didn't have too much history other then he he bought it in IL or IA and taken it to upstate NY where he did basically nothing to it.

[J. Skelly]

Look for a machined pad on the top of the engine just behind the intake manifold.  As I recall, look from the passenger side of the car.  I believe the first character should be 'F' for DeVille convertible, followed by a '9' for the 1969 model year, then the last several numbers of the VIN which should match the last several numbers of the VIN tag riveted to the base of the dashboard that can be seen through the windshield from the driver's side.

[R Simone]

Thanks J. Skelly I'll be sure to check that area out and compare to my VIN tomorrow AM!  We had a productive day today - Engine is out, just need to pull the carb and distributor tomorrow AM, then it and will go to the machine shop Monday AM.

[billyoung]

Beautiful Cadillac. This is the for what it's worth department. Some years ago on another Cadillac forum a guy said that when rebuilding a 472 it is critical that the same bolts go back in the same places they came out of. The way to do it is use cardboard box flats and draw a diagram of the area on the engine being disassembled and push the bolts in so they can be returned to the same spot. He said he versed the mechanic on this but the guy disregarded his insisted request and the engine does not run right. Again I feel it is important to mention, it does not seem that hard to accomplish and it may save future headaches. I hope this helps.

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

First digit should be a "6" indicating Cadillac, followed by the year number "9" followed by a letter indicating the engine plant followed by the engine (and "possibly" the vehicle VIN number
Greg Surfas

[R Simone]

I haven't cleaned it, but I'm not seeing any hint of a VIN.The only numbers I'm seeing at the back of the engine block are the casting number that tells me it's a 472?

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

the number for your '69 should end in 6238.  Those are the csting numbers found on1968 and 1969 motors, all 472's. It is POSSIBLE but unlikely that someone has modified the block to take a 500 crank.
Greg Surfas

[R Simone]

Yep, the block casting # which is 1486238 which according to another thread denotes a 68/69 472, but I'm trying to determine if it's the original engine to the car - (just out of curiosity really).  I'm not seeing any machined surfaces at the back of the block.  Getting the engine bay cleaned up for some fresh paint.

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

Here is a shot of the '69 motor (I did a Hi Po build during covid) I have. this number is stamped into the block just behind the driver's side cylinder head. Coincidentally this motor was the original equipment that went into a 1970 CdV that was early production.
Greg Surfas

[J. Skelly]

thanks for the clarification, Greg; maybe I was thinking of the 425 in my '77

[R Simone]

Thanks Greg! It IS the original engine. I don't think I would have found it without the pictures you shared - It's covered in 50+ years of gunk!

Off to the machine shop tomorrow!

[R Simone]

Slow going at the machine shop so just a waiting game for the most part and ordering this and that for reassembly.  Picked up some parts to have powder coated Cadillac Blue and that iron intake was just as heavy as I imagined lol.

They are questioning my Rockers which have some wear as you can see in the pics. It idled smooth as silk with no chatter whatsoever (before the tool that damaged the engine - I never heard it run after he damaged it, but he said lower end knock). I don't have tolerances and didn't find any on here, but am a bit afraid to buy online because everyone (including machine shop) says to reused the old parts when you can.  Also, I don't want to spend thousands on a rebuild and have a few hundred in small parts cause a failure. The pedestals were in great shape with very little wear.  Advice - opinions?

[James Landi]

Your hydraulic lifters adjust to normal wear. The mechanic should be able to assess any parts of the rocker assembly, push rods and hydraulic lifters that are excessively worn right now.  When the engine is running again, with the valve covers off, one can check for push-rods that are not spinning-- a tell tale.  In my experience, with proper oil flow, these parts can endure some wear and still function well. In the final analysis, if the rebuild is done well, and you're not expecting the engine, transmission, and drive train to endure full throttle operation,  you'll likely be satisfied with the results. James

[Cape Cod Fleetwood]

The engine is apart, replace everything with brand new. If your shop is any good, especially if they do race engines, they know who the good suppliers are and those parts will be expensive. The ONLY things original in my engine is the block and valve covers. Critical to dyno, critical. It shows you if the engine works before its reinstalled, shows any leaks and shows you power. In my last pull they got another 50hp and 150ftlbs of torque. Change the flexplate, you're right there. New water, oil and fuel pumps (get the correct fuel pump, I believe yours takes an internal filter). I had my engine pulled and rebuilt during the summer of The Flu since all the car shows were cancelled due to the inherent dangers of fresh air and sunshine. Your shop will give you a break in protocol, follow that to mile and MPH, change the oils on time.
This was the shop http://www.reidsautomotive.com/