Folks,
I ordered a pinion seal for my 37 LaSalle Coupe. Turns out it is the wrong one. The seal I received has 30067 stamped on it. When I reference pinion seals in my National book it comes up with the same number. The Victor number, from my book, is 49234, not sure if this is correct or not.
The problem is that the 30067 is a flat seal, while the one on the car is more of a cone.
Anyone run into this perplexing problem before? Or has the correct number?
John Washburn
John,
I think the 37 differential is the same as a 38 and in that case a flat seal is correct. The "cone" shape is the carrier for the seal. The seal presses into the carrier and the carrier is in turn pressed into the pinion housing. Getting the seal carrier out of the pinion housing without destroying it can be somewhat difficult. I was told to drill a small hole in the seal carrier flange, thread in a screw and use the screw to pull the carrier and old seal out in one piece. Solder up the hole when you replace it. Coopers has or had a seal that would fit the pinion housing without using the seal carrier but were quite a bit more expensive.
Tom Beaver
I have a '37 series 50 and leaking pinion seal, car was bought at auction and had been well restored for nearly most part. I looked at Kanter autoparts website and it lists 2 5/8" or a 3 5/8" OD options for this vehicle, but the seal on my car is 2 7/8" OD. Does anyone know if this is the correct rear end for this vehicle, or perhaps it came from another related car?
Hmm...after looking at the service manual the thing I'm measuring is that outer cover. Never seen one before but appreciate Tom's info on how to remove it. I take it you are saying the seal come out with it? Do you just reinstall with a large socket like a normal pinion seal? My service book is a bit sketchy on this, in fact I can't find anything on that, just the axle seals.
Found that the 37 uses a cup seal for the pinion. These are extremely hard to find. So pull the old seal housing out like Tom says, then remove the seal.
Then install the following one, also plug the holes you drilled (with jb weld or such) before re-installation:
National Oil Seal 473179
1.7/8†shaft size (1.875â€) by 2 ¾†OD (2.758
Use the old cup pinion housing, press out old seal and press this one in.
jw
Thanks for such a fast response, greatly appreciated, but seems these are not so hard to find if that part number is correct, first place I tried (*ebay) had a few of them. They are a flat-ish looking seal and described as axle seal, is that the correct part?
:)
http://motors.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=National+Oil+Seal+473179&_sacat=&_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&_odkw=National+Oil+Seal+473179&_osacat=0&bkBtn=&_trksid=p4506.m270.l1313 (http://motors.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=National+Oil+Seal+473179&_sacat=&_dmpt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&_odkw=National+Oil+Seal+473179&_osacat=0&bkBtn=&_trksid=p4506.m270.l1313)
S
Oh, and has anyone tried a large pipe wrench to the OD of the seal housing (cup?) seems like it might work and be a bit easier.
;D
Ok I trust you and ordered it. After I re-read the instructions I understood what you were saying about the cup part. I have a press, so no worries. I may take some pics for others in future.
Scott
Scott Philbrook
Houston tx
Dirkdaddy, Axle seals are NOT the same as pinion seals. Jim Stampler has been through this process of pinion seals and obtained two separate seals to take the place of the deep one. the 37 should have the deep one, Search this site for 37 pinion seals.
Your wrong also Tom because the 37 is not the same as 38, the 38 is a different diff altogether, they use different seals, but Jim and I have been finding 37 La Salles with 38 diffs fitted. they will interchange but the drive shaft has to be altered.
The 37 differential has three set bolts with nuts about 2" back from pinion end of the housing. They are at about 10-2 and 6 o'clock roughly and go in towards the pinion bearing and hold something in place, the bearing race probably. 37 was the last year, at least on 50 and 60 series, though other Cadillacs and LaSalles of previous years have the similar bolt arrangement. They quit those bolts for 38 and as Steve says, possibly late in the 37 production year.
When I put a new pinion seal in my 37-60 rear end, I went by measurement and bought them from a bearing supply house in a nearby city. You can Google up several quite easily. Instead of going with the 3/4" long seal, which is something of a bear to extract, I went with two 3/8' long seals at a cost of $5.15 each plus postage. They work just fine and installed with no trouble at all and leak not a drop. I think Steve has done this too. These seals are very inexpensive when you go to the source.
Let us know if your rear end has the bolts or not. I am sort of trying to work out just what they did there with that rear end change. The not bolted 37s may have also been a dealer replacement post 1937. Jim Stamper CLC#13470
it is possible that I have one or more of those seals - I bought a box of seals around 30 years ago - find the list on my web page (www.wbnoble.com) and see if it's there, and if it is, then you can contact me.
Here is a picture or two of the rear diff. Maybe that will be worth 100 words? Thanks all for hints. Let you good folks look at it.
Definitely a 37 rear end, not a 38.
The two seal method described above worked good for mine. Jim Stamper CLC#13470
Folks,
Picture of the original cup seal for the pinion 1938 on up.
John Washburn
For future reference, the '37 LaSalle rear end seal measures 2.5" OD, and the inner yoke dia is 1.5" OD. This project was put on back burner for a while as other cars were not running or whatever, but getting on it now. Yes, it was a fight getting the seal out! SOB. Now to look for that seal...
Follow Jim's advice and replace the seal with two thiner ones back to back, just take it to a seal supplier and ask for two seals with the same ID and OD but not the same thickness, both together they will make up the required size.
Jim may still have the number of the ones he bought.
Sorry, I don't think have the numbers. But I just called a bearing/seal supply house and gave them the dimensions. They were $5.15 each. They installed easily, since they are only 3/8" each and haven't leaked a drop. These supply house guys are the source, they are asked to fit things all of the time. They had at least five options for me to choose from. Often a general source is the better place to go rather than our specialty sources, for some things.
Jim Stamper CLC# 13470
"The 37 differential has three set bolts with nuts about 2" back from pinion end of the housing." On my '37 75 series, the 3 bolts bear on the very end of a sleeve. The sleeve pushes the front double row pinion shaft ball bearing forward and holds it in place. If you take one of the bolts out, you will see the end of the bolt is tapered (conical). You can safely remove one of the bolts to see what I'm trying to describe - it won't affect the bearing adjustment. The smaller series '37 cars may not use a sleeve and the 3 conical bolts may bear directly on the edge of the ball bearing.
No Gene, the smaller series has the sleeve too.
Again for reference, the seal guy gave me this part number, its a 3/8" seal use 2x of them. # 152537TB
Had to order it be in next week.
When reading about 37 pinion seal repairs I see that 37 and 38 rear ends will interchange except for a drive line modification .What needs to be changed on the drive line to make this work? I have both drive lines and they both look the same. M. Robinson
May be the drive shaft length?
I own a 1947 Cadillac and had the same problem. After removing the drive shaft flange, i drove the seal forward out of the cone toward the pinion bearing, then i took a small bearing puller and reversed the puller arms so they were to the outside. i inserted the puller to the inside of the cone And was able to pull it out with no problem. I purchased a seal (3/8" thick) & installed it in the cone. Everybody is talking about installing 2 seals to replace the original seal, but i used only 1 and that was 6 years ago & 25,000 miles with no leaks. The only problem i had was the puller i used was a little to big and i had to grind down the ends to be able to pull the cone. I believe the 2 seal idea was also good as they are very cheap. The main reason for installing 2 seals is that there may be excessive wear on the drive shaft flange & with 2 seals they will seat at different locations which will seal better.
Lee DeVol
Hello Scott. Is that a " National " part # ? John Lehman CLC # 26365...
John- That is the Victor number for 38 and 39; the 1937 number is 49233.
mike Simmons
Quote from: Mike Simmons 938 on October 15, 2012, 08:25:05 PM
John- That is the Victor number for 38 and 39; the 1937 number is 49233.
mike Simmons
What I got from a supplier is:
DICHTOMATIK
TCM
OIL SEAL
PART NO 152537TA-BX
Others probably work too, but that is what the guy sold me and it working so far. Only I can't drive the car more as its overheating and now I have the heads off cleaning out the cooling passages and waiting on my headgasket.