Hey guys,
My '67 Deville pulls to the right. Last week I thought that it might have something to do with something as simple as uneven tire pressure. So, I mad sure the tire pressure was equal (left-right, front, rear). Took the car for a drive, and noticed that the car did not pull to the right anymore, but the steering wheel was off center when going straight.
However, after say 30 miles, the car has started pulling to the right again. The car was alilgned last year. No work to suspension or balljoints/tie rod ends has been done. I also did not hit any curbs or anything.
Could it be that (I assum the right) the tie rod end is worn, causing the pull? Or is a worn ball joint a more likely cause?
How do I check this? And can the pulling only be caused by a worn tie rod end joint or could a worn ball joint (upper / lower) also be the culprit.
Just wanted to check first because I have the feeling that something is simply amiss that cannot be fixed by aligning the car.
Thanks in advance.
Julien.
Pulling can also be a brake problem. If the pull is to the right it could be that brake binding or the left one not working as well as it should.
There was a lengthy discussion on testing ball joints about 3 weeks ago on this Forum.
http://forums.cadillaclasalleclub.org/index.php?topic=135087.msg296673#msg296673
Checking tie rods and idler arms:
1. Jack up front end take both tires off the ground. (a hoist is the best as you will see in a moment)
2. point wheels straight ahead.
3. get in front of the tires and push outward. (place hands at the level of the bearing)
4. then pull the tires together
5. repeat
As you push the tires apart and pull them together observe for any motion in the tie rods and idler arm. The idler arm may move up and down slightly the tie rod ends should not move at all. (you are looking to see if the ball part moves in the socket)
The amount of play is easily discernible.
FYI tie rods set the toe in/out measurement. Wear here represents 90% of tire wear and scuffing. RARELY do worn tie rods (or idler arms) cause a pull.
Pulls are generally the result of;
1. mismatched tire sizes - this includes under inflated tires such that their circumference is different.
2. Road conditions such as heavily crowned roads
3. Changes in the CASTER settings (the 'tilt' of the spindle) These changes are generally caused by worn/missing rubber bushings or other A-arm problems
4. SOMETIMES camber settings can cause a pull but again camber changes come from bushing/A-arm problems.
You haven't mentioned your STRUT BAR bushings(?) These DO hold the caster and if the rubber is bad then you can have a pull.
Ball joints CAN SOMETIMES become so worn that they might possibly change the caster/camber but they are blamed for many more problems than they actually cause.
Another note: hard to explain why but only the lower ball joint actually carries the vehicle weight, so only the lower ball joint ever wears. I guess it is possible to have a worn upper ball joint but this is very very unlikely. Still people replace them all the time anyway and generally without checking them.
Idler arms and rubber bushings are the only problems in the front end 95% of the time.
Well, I kind of already ruled out the brakes as I replaced the front shoes, cylidners, hoses, fluid (left and right ofcourse). Also, switched the drums from (left and right) to see if that would make a difference. It didn't. And I figured that if the brakes were the problem, it would pull all the time. And the funny thing is, that when I corrected the tire pressure (front left and right, right was underinflated), it did NOT pull anymore (but now the steering wheel was off center when going down the road straight). Like I said in my earlier post, the pull returned after about 20 or 30 miles (which lead me to think something was wrong with the ball joints causing a difference in caster, camber or toe in/out, causing the pull). But looking at the other posts, that does not appear to be the problem. In the other ball joint thread, the problems were caused by worn rubber bushings. I will have a look at these this week.
m-man: by strut bar, do you mean the stabilizer bar? Or the stabilizer linkages?
The Strut Bars are the two straight bars that mount diagonally between the front cross member and each of the lower control arms (A-arms). They are bolted to the A-arms and the bushings are on/in the cross member.
The stabilizer bar runs cross ways near the front cross member and connects the two lower control arms. (it uses the long bolt with 4 round bushings to connect to the bar. If the stabilizer bushings are bad, the bar can clunk and bang around and the car might lean more in a corner, but it will never cause a pull.
Oh BTW, don't worry about whether the steering wheel is straight.
A crooked wheel might indicate worn parts but it can also indicate an incomplete alignment sometime in the past.
The important thing is that a crooked wheel does not CAUSE a pull. (but you might find yourself pulling it straight up to compensate for other worn parts)
Once everything is fixed and tight again, part of the correct alignment process is to 'center set' the steering wheel/steering gear by properly adjusting the tire rods while setting the toe in.
Julien:
Given what you describe and what you have so far done to correct it, it is clear to me you have a tire pull. Nothing is wrong with your car that a new tire won't fix. Tires can and do wear unevenly, they can actually wear in a "cone" shape you can't notice but that pulls the car to one side. That tire pressure changed the manifestation but not the problem cinches it for me. Move the fronts to the back and see what happens.
Dan
I had that a year ago. The car always pulled to the left when braking hard. Not too bad but it did pull a bit. Well, I let it be and worked on different things until there was a rubbing noise when braking. Turned out that only the secondary brake shoe was braking. Because of the self-reinforcing nature of the brake set-up only the secondary shoe would take the load. Well, the rivets cut two nice deep grooves in my brake drum.
Reason for pulling to the left: A loose star wheel due to a bent and badly installed adjusting lever. Plus some badly worn-out teeth.
Although you replaced the brakes, I would still check again that the adjusting lever does secure the star wheel from turning freely.
Regards,
Nicolas
Hey guys, just a quick update.
My jack simply died (well, it has done its job for about 40+ years so I give it a break). So I haven't gotten round to rotate the tires. I am planning to rotate front right with rear left and see whether that makes any difference. I hope its a tire pull, because then the solution is easy! :).
Some other stuff that has got financial priority now, so it is on the back burner for now. But somewhere in the next two weeks I will most likely get round to it. Will keep yo updated.
Thanks for the replies so far.