Advice and Comments on 1968 to 1978

[BJM]

I am hoping some of you can comment on my next collection move.   I am 52 1/2, have a mortgage, a 15 year old to get through college in 4 years, and retirement looms. 

I have owned well over 250 cars in the past 35 years including a 1964 Coupe deVille and 2 1967 Eldorados, a 1941 60S, and a 1941 63 series.   However, I am not able to purchase a $15,000 car or thereabouts.

But, the good part for me is I was born in 1964 and have always loved the 70's.  I have mostly collected Buicks.

I have about $6500 burning a hole in my savings pocket.  I have NO cars in a 2 car garage.  The garage is decrepid and unheated, was built in 1947 and I will be "solidifying" it in 2017.  But it's crappy compared to what I had 3 years ago.

I am addicted to the old car hobby and have tried to get out.  I love those Sunday afternoons though when a person can wash their car, detail it, wax it and slowly drive it through neighborhoods and by ways.

I have vacillated back and forth between "restorations / projects" and drivers.  I am firmly in the NEVER GOING TO BUY A RESTORATION PROJECT AGAIN mode due to costs and what appears above - college and retirement.

If I was a lover of much older Cadillacs  as I have been I would be screwed because of price. I would not be able to afford a nice older Cadillac until maybe age 70, and that is about 17 years away.

But I truly love the "stayin' alive" era and have been looking on Craigs List in about a 500 - 600 mile circumference around DES MOINES Iowa where my crappy 2 car garage is.

I personally love the 1968-69 Eldorados.  I don't care for the 1967's or 1970's as much.   I have located an 85,000 mile 2 owner 1969 Eldorado and negotiated a $3500 purchase price but have not "pulled the trigger".  Those who know me on the AACA Forums know I am a procrastinator and lose out on a lot of cars, but because I have lost about $125,000 on my cars, and a lot is at stake with the next purchase, I am reluctant to jump.

I believe this 1969 Eldorado is a nice car. It has 2 blemishes. The drivers arm rest has a 2 inch stress crack and there is a bubble of rust on the very rear of the drivers rear quarter.   It has just received about $1700 in new parts - 4 new tires, complete rear brakes and a new master cylinder.

The color is a nice mid green with black cloth interior.  He was asking $4400.  I offered $3500 and he said that was Ok because he did not want to store and pay storage fees. 

I love the car (subject to viewing) and my problem is the addiction aspect of the hobby. With about $6500 to use, I keep telling myself buy this car and STOP.   But a collector of anything has a hard time stopping, right.

I am 100% sure I could stop at 2 nice cars.  I have had as many as 9. 

Based on some criteria, I decided to limit my Craigs List parameters to 1968 to 1978 Cadillac, price point $10 to $4500.  My basis for $4500 was that I would be able to negotiate down, which I successfully did on the 69 Eldorado.  If the seller won't budge then no harm no foul, I must move on.

I looked in Iowa, Minneapolis, Chicago, some Omaha and Kansas City.

In Iowa I found only a 1976 Buick Electra Limited 2 door for $3000 with 42,000 original miles and missing those silly plastic rear bumper fillers.  Based on that, I am pretty sure a $2500 offer gets this car.  Like I said, I love these mid seventies 2 or even 4 door Buicks and Cadillacs, maybe even Imperials.

But no other "quality" Cadillacs in about the $3500 or less range.  (In Iowa)

My best search was Minneapolis and 2nd - Chicago.  I understand the issue with rust in Minneapolis - and Chicago - but assuming the seller's have a modicum of honesty - I am passing on those with issues.

I found at least 6 70's Coupe deVilles in the Minneapolis Craigs List which I want and are in my price range.  Chief among these is this 1973 Coupe deVille in triple black with 44,000 miles.  I have already negotiated a $3500 price on this car with original wheel set (I have no interest in the custom wheels)

https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/cto/5851055055.html

The issue here is that the $3500 for the 69 Eldorado and the $3500 for the 73 Coupe deVille are over my savings, and based on what else I have spotted, I can not have BOTH!

This is as much about making a decision on ONE car or putting 2 great cars in the garage, even if one, such as the 69 Eldorado, get punted. 

Here is the Eldorado, by the way:

https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/cto/5844939293.html

If I had a "slight" desire, I would go for a round headlight car over a square headlight car but I also feel the quad headlight era produced good looking Cadillacs. 

Here is a 1977 Coupe deVille in colors I love:

https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/cto/5844294895.html

I am a big Tan Metallic fan, but the ad is odd in that I would think a stored 1970's Coue deVille offered for $2500 or offer would be gone by now and I am assuming it does NOT run, being in dry storage for 20 years, but it is out there and I could swing this car at $2000 with the Eldorado or the 73 Triple Black car.

Here is a nice 93,000 mile 1977 Coupe deVille for offered $3850:

https://minneapolis.craigslist.org/ank/cto/5836209110.html

Again, I think I would offer $3000 or so on this car to fill the 2nd stall and enjoy the heck out of it.  Or is it over-priced being on the market so long without a sale?  (Comparing it to the 77 in storage for $2500)

Here is a 73 Coupe deVille in Iowa, with faded paint (no photos, but close):

https://desmoines.craigslist.org/cto/5825978193.html

Here is the 76 Buick Limited for comparison (of value and interest):

https://siouxcity.craigslist.org/cto/5831627275.html

I found this cool 1971 Limousine on Chicago Craigs List:

https://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/cto/5865467018.html

The series 75 just went on CL, and so the seller is probably not going to negotiate down to the $3000 or so level I would need.  I have always loved the series 75 Limousine class Cadillacs and as some of you know there is an eccentric seller in Newton Iowa that has a 1956 Imperial 75 for sale for $4500, full on project, that I would love to have and restore. 

But my commitment to NOT buy a project at this stage in my life is FIRM.  Therefore, I looked at this 1971 car in what looks like black / blue and I like the lines, well integrated. I am NOT a fan of the 60's series 75's because they look a like odd to me (no offense, I am only looking at photos).

I can imagine myself taking this to car shows and allowing folks to sit in a circa 1971 Limousine and imagine themselves being a star or business celebrity.  I can also see myself with a side business of weddings and proms, and taking my daughter to prom in this car. 

I also think it would be a fun intermediate trip car. say a person was going to a B&B for the weekend about 150 miles away and you could convince the wife to drive and you could sit back there and relax, that would be a unique experience.  So, overall, this car appeals to me. 

It's your job to dissuade me!

I am not opposed to Sedan de'Villes but frankly I have seen fewer in the same nice condition of some of the Coupe de'Villes.  Here is an example of a color I love, a price which is too high, but decent low mileage:

https://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/cto/5799587337.html

Here is a 77 Fleetwood with a poor photo set, 28,000 original miles:

https://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/cto/5802100076.html

A 77 Sedan deVille with another poor photo set (how do these sellers expect to sell their cars based on 2 cell phone photos?):

https://milwaukee.craigslist.org/cto/5861056605.html

I prefer pre 1977 GM big bodies.  Compare the open air 4 door hardtop-ness of this 1976 Sedan deVille over the last posted almost gloomy 1977:

https://milwaukee.craigslist.org/cto/5850959617.html

It is interesting to note - I found very little in the way of 1968 to 1978 Cadillacs up to $4500 in Kansas City and none worth posting here.  Obviously the old car market is dynamic and some of these will sell and some more will come on, but I am going to get my savings out now and be ready to go.

So what does the collective talent here think?  Just focus on one car and save my money?  What years are easier on the wallet to maintain?   

I found it interesting and sad that I found NO other 1968-69 Eldorados in that price range or else I "might" have gone with a 1-2 punch of a different color 1968 or 1969 Eldorado. I really like them.

BUT, I could pass on that one if I could get 2 low mileage 70's Cadillacs for bargain money. 

What do you think?

["Cadillac Kid" Greg Surfas 15364]

Decisions, decisions, decisions.
Greg Surfas

[76eldo]

If I was on a budget I would buy the Eldorado and make it as nice as possible with some of the other money.

Why saddle yourself with two cars for the sake of filling the garage?

The 73 Coupe sounds nice to but I think the Eldo has more chance of increasing in value in the short term.

Brian

[Scot Minesinger]

If $6,500 is your budget buy one nice car for under 4k and keep the remainder as a reserve in case repairs are needed.  Be happy with what you have.  You did not say if you are performing your own mechanical work, hope so.  It is easy to burn thru even $6,500 in a year on mechanical work for an older car unless you do the work yourself to save labor and parts mark-up (which can be 100% and higher easy).  The 1968 thru 1979 Cadillacs seem to be very little trouble finding mechanical parts to keep going at good prices.  RWD is better mechanically I think. 

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

For reliability, relative ease and simplicity of maintenance, comfort, convenience and just plain all around driving satisfaction in the traditional mold of big V8 RWD format, a Tri7 (77-78-79) RWD DeVille is difficult to beat.

If funds are limited, I would especially advise steering clear of early FWD cars as the drivelines are more complex and more expensive to tend, whereas RWD is about as bulletproof as it gets and prices - even for some of the most outstanding examples - are absurdly low. 

Recommend buying the finest original Tri7 Coupe deVille you can find and don't look back.

[cadillacmike68]

Don't get a Fleetwood Brougham (or 60 Special or 60 special Brougham) because that 3.5" extra wheelbase means a LOT of Fleetwood specific parts, and are thus harder to get.  That is unless  you Like Fleetwoods, like I do.

I would say a 68-70 DeVille convertible or a Coupe deVille (thru78 or79) would be a great car.The 73 and later have the bad habit of self disintegrating body to bumper fillers.

ElDorados, while nice, have the aforementioned FWD and its attendant long term maintenance as well as even harder to find parts for some years.

[Scot Minesinger]

A convertible in the 1968-76 era for Cadillacs would be nice, but they are not available in reasonable shape for less than 6.5k.  The scissor tops of the 71-76 Eldorados coupled with front drive make them way less expensive than the 68-70 convertibles.  However repairs to the 71-76 Eldorado convertibles are more expensive than the 68-70 RWD Cadillac convertibles.  To meet your price a closed Cadillac is your best bet, and the 77-79 Cadillacs are very nice.

[BJM]

Combining the comments, there is a consensus to consider the 77-79 years of Coupe deVille. I will avoid Fleetwoods, they are neat for their over indulgent factor but not worth extra headache.

I was an ASE Master tech in a previous career and have retained most of my tools including diagnostics.  I can maintain a car.  I restored a 1966 Toronado and I mean restored - everything came out then back in so I appreciate the concern over the FWD. 

I am still going to go for that 1969 Eldorado, and if it is gone or I drive it and don't feel confident I will try something else.

As for the idea of buying just one car, it is ironic that most of you, maybe all of you commenters have multiple Cadillacs and cars.  Each one as you know provides a different sensory and ownership experience and it is hard to stop.    But I might, I just want to see if I can get 2 and play my ownership experiences off each one. 

Thanks for the comments, I am being steered. 

[BJM]

Don't get a Fleetwood Brougham (or 60 Special or 60 special Brougham) because that 3.5" extra wheelbase means a LOT of Fleetwood specific parts, and are thus harder to get.  That is unless  you Like Fleetwoods, like I do.

I would say a 68-70 DeVille convertible or a Coupe deVille (thru78 or79) would be a great car.The 73 and later have the bad habit of self disintegrating body to bumper fillers.

ElDorados, while nice, have the aforementioned FWD and its attendant long term maintenance as well as even harder to find parts for some years.

That is another reason I steer way away from 1967 Eldorados. I could not find parts when I had them, I also felt Cadillac rushed that car to market with most having drum brakes and the interiors were not as well detailed as 1968-69. 

I really like the Coupe deVilles in the 70's,  pretty much all years.

I looked again last night and found nothing new but looked again at most of these.  My 1st choice would be that triple black 1973 in northern MN with 44,000 miles.  There is just something about triple black in a 70's car that exudes coolness and intrigue.   

It amazes me how many white cars made it.

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

No need to fear a Fleetwood Brougham unless you're considering a car with a lot of missing parts. Since you are not, you should not and from a mechanical standpoint the difference between a Fleetwood and junior models for all practical purposes is nothing worth talking about.

Incidentally, I also recommend avoiding Tri7s with optional Fuel Injection. As it was seldom ordered it's not very likely you'll encounter many in your shopping but I thought it should be pointed out all the same. Stay with 4 bbl carburetor cars (425 ci) and don't exclude 1980 Cadillac with 6.0 (368 ci) 4 bbl either. (368 was the last Cadillac-built V8 w/carb)

One final point - 1977 & up cars were far more resistant to rust than any prior model Cadillac as a result of completely new anti corrosion measures undertaken by GM in all new downsized full sized models. 

Good luck in your search.

[Scot Minesinger]

If I had to work with a $6,500 budget there might only be one if any at all classic in my garage (no way more than one).  The 1969 Eldorado is wonderful Cadillac, hope you win it and then enjoy!

[jdemerson]

As for the idea of buying just one car, it is ironic that most of you, maybe all of you commenters have multiple Cadillacs and cars.  Each one as you know provides a different sensory and ownership experience and it is hard to stop.    But I might, I just want to see if I can get 2 and play my ownership experiences off each one. 

Thanks for the comments, I am being steered.

Not sure there is irony here, given your clear indication of a $6,500 ceiling. Many of us would feel that your best strategy is to get the best car you can find (meeting your own preferences), and if you can get if for $4,500 use the $2000 to maintain it and perhaps do some modest upgrades. Down the road if circumstances permit you can always add another Cadillac (or two or three) to your garage!

I love the '68, '69, '70 Devilles and Fleetwoods. The reason so many have mentioned the 1977-79 models is that you can do a lot better there for the $6,500.  And they are (objectively) better cars. But you clearly have lots of mechanical ability, and you should get whatever floats your boat. We look forward to hearing about it!

Good luck!
John

[Chuck Patton]

Hello BJM

Glad to read of your desire to buy a Cadillac.  Please receive my suggestions first.

(1) Join our Cadillac & LaSalle Club to become familiar with the global market of LaSalle's and Cadillac's
(2) Become a member and participate with a Region near your residence
(3) LEARN about various Cadillac vehicle era's BEFORE you purchase
(4) Discuss the finances of owning and maintaining a Cadillac WITH your wife
(5) Do not have a steak appetite and a hamburger budget
(6) Ask a knowledgeable CLC Member to evaluate the vehicle BEFORE you purchase
(7) Analyze the vehicle records and receipts of the car you select BEFORE you purchase
( Explain to your 15 year old that this is a fun family item for them to enjoy
(9) Acquire the Cadillac Service and Shop Manuals for your vehicle
(10) Ask any and all questions.

We exist to assist.

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

Again reiterating the recommendation to buy the best example that can be found. It will pay off in spades in the long run. To get involved in any project is a question that should be pondered carefully, especially models which are of modest value to begin with. 

Nothing can jade the newbie to the old car hobby as much as being upside down in the multiples right out of the starting gate; the importance of getting it right cannot be overemphasized.

Quality is remembered long after price is forgotten.   

[James Landi]

  Having experienced a similar set of family and professional obligations, and attempting to find some sense of personal pleasure carved out of a life overflowing with obligations,  I have focused on "drive-able" road worthy Cadillac convertibles that I could use without concern for running up miles or feel depressed about because another seam ripped in the seat.   I have an 85 convertible with an Oldsmobile conversion engine that floats my boat... from ten feet away, it looks fabulous, and runs great, and it has very little resale value. When I drive it, it looks and feels like new from my vantage point, so emotionally, it serves an fractional yet important purpose in my life.   James

[Scot Minesinger]

Really great advice on this column.  It is a hobby and should be fun, so taking all this in and keeping it fun is important.  Always been a car guy, and bought my first classic in 2005 after had my 3 kids college savings good, retirement savings under control, and otherwise financially stable.  It has been major enjoyment in my life.  Although I'm super busy, you always have to drive places, so getting much enjoyment by just driving my 1970 Cadillacs to mandatory events and meetings.

Keep in mind strong cosmetics drive price, and strong mechanicals do not seem to mean too much on price, except:

1.  Running and driving car is worth way more than a Cadillac that does not drive.
2.  Working climate control (especially a/c) adds value, as this era of Cadillac does contain climate controls that are unique and most are not familiar with repairs.  I fixed mine thoroughly ten years ago, and with almost no attention to them still work fine today.

Enjoy the searching and buying process.

[BJM]

Thanks all for the comments and suggestions.  I have moved my semi liquid $6000 to a more accessible savings spot. Work and distance to the cars under consideration have meant no decision yet.

I have also expanded my 2 nd car consideration to Lincoln personal luxury cars from 1969 to 1976, obviouslt the Mark Continentals.  I like the shape of these cars too and it would be interesting to have an Eldorado and a Mark.  They built a lot of Mark's from 1969 to 1976 and there are many low mileage cars in the marketplace.

As is normal and usual for Craigs List - offers and requests sent to Cadillac owners in some of the interesting ads get no response and many CL ads have no phone numbers. 

[James Landi]

Byran,  Give me a call about my 85 Biarritz convertible... James Landi  443 235 0022