First ever drive issues help please

[Glaswegian]

I finally got my registration through and the Park Avenue went for its maiden voyage this morning !

It took quite a few goes to get her started after about 5 weeks idle, the fuel bowl filter being changed and bowl almost empty of fuel, but when warme starts now with no pedal almost imediately 

I took things slow and drove to the nearest gas station to at least put several gallons in. I was worried about the restarting but as above was instant, very happy! The brakes are needing some work, I was told the system had an overhall and think it may just need bled, may be the bendix system fitted as looks like the one in the manual, not the brass coloured caps with the wire cover? pedal does not do much then has to be pressed hard to engage but does stop the car. Will get the garage to test and look at the condition of the shoes etc when I'm getting oil change and radiator/engine flushed.

The fuel gauge works but does bounce about when going over bumps, is that normal ? but main concern was temperature gauge never moved at all. I looked in the manual and it says to check thermogauge. I've no idea where to look for that ! can somebody point me in right direction please? I did also notice the front doors opening does not appear to bring interior dash light on now either, maybe linked? was working, checked the fuses, all ok. The dash pad has been off so maybe I disturbed or pulled a cable while repairing the wiper switch which is near the Temp one ! The dash light does work if you move the switch, its only on or off? no mid position? is that correct ? The rear door lights only work from the switch on back seat, again is that a on or off switch no mid position ? the rear doors opening never made dash light come on, only fronts did originally.

Car is much faster than I expected, power steering works very well and going over speed bumps was very smooth, more like a Landrover Discovery, excellent ! Vacuum tank seems to be working correctly now, trunk popped open via glove compartment button. Tried AC and think it may be blowing cool though not super cold, hard to believe that  both fan switches worked.

So the temp gauge is most urgent fix as no idea how hot car is running, initial drive was for about 15/20 mins so thought it would have moved at least to 1/4 way ? and when I returned and lifted hood engine seemed nice and warm while touching radiator hoses etc.

Any thoughts advice much appreciated 

[Glaswegian]

OK, found the temp sender on top of the engine. Cable was not attached and like everything else plug was covered in black greasy dirt. Washed and cleaned the plug and the pin from the sensor( plug has a little damage to cover ) and stuck back on. Hopefully the gauge will work next journey.

Thanks for the reply Steven, was mid writing this when you replied  Yes map light, we have different terms for things here, try to use yours, trunk for boot and fenders for wings and so forth. The Map light would come on when front doors only were opened, now nothing unless I flick switch on but does not go off when door closes. Hope that makes sense?

Took a pic of the brake system for ID please ? and any thoughts.

[35-709]

If you have to press hard on the brake pedal to stop the car, it may be you are not getting vacuum assist from the power booster behind the master.  Be sure the vacuum hose to the booster is hooked up and that it is getting good vacuum.

Check the gas tank sending unit for good ground, a loose or dirty connection making intermittent contact will make the gauge jump around.  Same, of course, for the connections on the back of the gas gauge. 

[Glaswegian]

Thank you for that info on brakes, had a quick look at hose ! connected at both ends with clamps too, the inlet valve on booster seems loose ? thought it would be a tight connection on the booster, not really loose just moves when you pull hose a bit, like its finger tight connected not spanner. Maybe that is loosing the vacuum?

It was so dirty down there, when I touched the inlet connection looks like its white plastic underneath the dirt, hose looks ok on outside and other vacuum hoses to res tank for other stuff from engine seems to be working ok.

This car has not been used for years and years ! going to be lots of wee niggles with it and I have never owned one so  I'm getting used to old cars and all the work you need to do before they become reliable. The dude who sold it to me lied about lots of stuff it seems but what's done is done and I just need to get to the bottom of all the problems.

Loved the first drive even though scary 

Thank you again guys

[TJ Hopland]

Does this have a vacuum reservoir?  If so that is a common place to have rust/leaks.   

[Glaswegian]

TJ, it does, but tank is new ! though 2 hoses going to it do not have tightening clamps on them, just tight ish push fit.

Single hose direct to brakes comes direct off the carb area not the tank so not sure if that would make a difference? maybe it does?

Can you fit any booster/master combo ? it might be easier for me to get something from UK supplier if so rather than the having to send the old one to USA to be rebuilt. I see kits are available to rebuild, but not 100% I'm quite up to that yet. Just a thought not assuming that is necessary yet ! just that the seller told me brake system had been rebuilt ! Langauge issues may have been cause of mix up, but he assured me all sorts of other stuff was sorted that was not   

[35-709]

TJ, it does, but tank is new ! though 2 hoses going to it do not have tightening clamps on them, just tight ish push fit.
Sounds fine but ANY vacuum leak takes away from the rest of the vacuum system.  Important to not have any vacuum leaks.
Single hose direct to brakes comes direct off the carb area not the tank so not sure if that would make a difference? maybe it does?
The white plastic fitting going into the booster is a tight push fit, I would remove and inspect the hose from that booster fitting (also probably tight) and also make sure you have good vacuum to the booster through the hose.  Old rubber hoses can collapse internally looking OK on the outside.  Be careful with the plastic fitting, it could be brittle, if you do break it or it is leaking they should be readily available, even where you are. Also make sure the rubber grommet the white plastic fitting goes into is in good condition --- not dry-rotted and holds the fitting snugly.
Can you fit any booster/master combo ?  No. it might be easier for me to get something from UK supplier if so rather than the having to send the old one to USA to be rebuilt. I see kits are available to rebuild, but not 100% I'm quite up to that yet. Just a thought not assuming that is necessary yet ! just that the seller told me brake system had been rebuilt ! Langauge issues may have been cause of mix up, but he assured me all sorts of other stuff was sorted that was not   

[Dan LeBlanc]

There are no baffles in the fuel tank.  When any less than full, the sloshing action of the gas in the tank will cause the needle to move up and down going over bumps.  Perfectly normal.  Tank baffles and buffering modules were not invented by this time, so movement of the gauge is perfectly normal.

The booster looks quite old.  That is a Bendix booster.  The Bendix systems required slightly more pedal pressure to stop the car, but not significantly so.  If you have to really push the pedal hard to stop the car, even though the brake check valve feels loose, there should be adequate vacuum in the booster to stop the car almost effortlessly.  If you hear hissing while the engine is running around that area, not good, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

I'd say you're pretty much in for a booster replacement which either means ordering a rebuilt unit or sending yours away.  They are a pain in the butt to change too.  You have to be a contortionist to get up under the dash to get the four nuts holding it in.

[Glaswegian]

Dan and G, thanks for the confirm about the Bendix    I suspect the booster is to blame and it'll just be a case of finding a supplier of a new one. Sending one back or sending this one to be rebuilt will be a real pain. I might see if I can find somebody here who will rebuild it from a kit. The costs of shipping stuff here is mad, then taxes on top too....

I will look at the plastic insert and hose some more, guessing if remove the insert the grommet will fall to bits though ! just like fuel bowl gasket did.

Somebody mentioned in another thread they changed the booster/master for one from a 65 I think as it had an updated twin something or other.

Maybe I should post up a request for a booster/main combo for sale ? would it still need to be the Bendix as that's what is already fitted?

I am replacing all the rubber hoses for window washers all the way from tank ! got an aftermarket pump to use for the moment till I sort out the one attached to the wiper motor.

Also was really surprised at the gearbox, I could not really tell it had changed, super smooth. Only used the first D position and maybe went as high as 40 mph due to worry about brakes.

Thank you so much for the help.

[Dan LeBlanc]

If you want to use the master cylinder you have, you'll have to stick with a Bendix unit.

[35-709]

Here is a new aftermarket unit that may be a good answer to your brake trouble.  You will still have to import it from the U.S. but that may be true of anything you have to buy to help your situation.

https://www.performanceonline.com/1959-62-Cadillac-Power-Brake-Booster-Conversion-Kit-/

Here is the forum thread it is from ---
http://forums.cadillaclasalleclub.org/index.php?topic=156817.0   

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

........ The dude who sold it to me lied about lots of stuff it seems but what's done is done and I just need to get to the bottom of all the problems.
Loved the first drive even though scary     

When I purchased my '60 CDV, way back, I too was told by the owner that the brakes had been checked out, and operated correctly by a local Brake Shop.

My first drive of the car was really hairy, and I wondered just what I had purchased.   It was dangerous.

When I carefully got her home, I pulled the wheels and brake drums off and what I found was the Left front drum was cracked, the right front and left rear wheel cylinders were frozen, and the right rear wheel cylinder was covered with crud, and working just a bit.

This car was a danger, and it was fitted with crossply tyres which although looking new, were very hard.

Rebuilding the brakes, replacing the tyres with radials and having doing a wheel alignment made the car a pleasure to drive.

Bruce.

PS.   One of the reasons the previous owner sold the car was because he had trouble driving it.   Now I know why.

[bcroe]

I too was told by the owner that the brakes had been checked out, and operated correctly by a local Brake Shop.

When I carefully got her home, I pulled the wheels and brake drums off and what I found was the Left front drum was cracked, the right front and left rear wheel cylinders were frozen, and the right rear wheel cylinder was covered with crud, and working just a bit.
   Bruce. 

The PO was a total liar.  Bruce Roe

[Glaswegian]

Many thanks again guys !

Yep my seller turns out to be the same sort of guy, a dealer in Sweden who says he is a member ! Everything is working he said  lesson learned

Anyhoo, that replacement unit looks the part and the cost to send was better than I thought, still 20% to add to the total after that though 

A rebuild of the original is $260 plus shipping only the booster, I would buy another master to go with it as I don't trust this one, makes more sense. Problem is they want old one back and it will double the cost of already expensive shipping.

I looked at the other thread, only says they used it, nothing more. I guess its a straight swap? thought maybe what's at the rear maybe different to what is on the car ? I feel a new thread coming on just for this subject.

More to delve into on this subject and research to be done.

[Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373]

We were pretty much the same as you when bringing the 55 back to life. I like your methodical approach and the fact that you are asking questions to learn vs just duct-taping the problem with an incorrect fix.
Well done and congrats on the 1st drive.
Jeff

[bcroe]

I canot BELIEVE how anyone can be so careless about brakes.  They
are the most important (deserving attention) system on a car. 

Bruce (going out to work on brakes) Roe

[Glaswegian]

I'm going to start a new thread on the brakes issue, but just to say the temp gauge now seems to be working and moved when car was restarted to check out the brakes issue.