Young do, indeed, lack enthusiasm for driving

[64\/54Cadillacking]

What are you basing this on?  While the average cost may be at or near highest in current dollars, government data/research appears to show that the average inflation adjusted cost of car ownership (fuel, maintenance, insurance, depreciation, etc) is actually lower today than most years dating back to that earliest data from 1975.

Inflation adjusted average ownership/operating cost per mile, based on 15k miles/year:
2018 â€" 60.1 cents
2008 â€" 64.4 cents
1998 â€" 72.3 cents
1975 â€" 69.5 cents

The overall cost of living on the coast for one thing hinders young
people ability to afford to own a car. You’re not adding in the overall expenses in terms of housing like rent, a mortgage, taxes, income, food cost, car insurance, and other factors which all reduces ones ability to own a vehicle.

Sure maybe living in Kentucky it’s not an issue, but here? It’s a struggle for sure even for well off millennials it’s still hard.

This should be an eye opener for all.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/business/real-estate/story/2019-04-24/san-diego-popular-with-millennials-not-so-much-study-shows

Only 2 percent of millennials that move here to my city can afford to buy a house, that’s insane to me!

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

The overall cost of living on the coast for one thing hinders young
people ability to afford to own a car. You’re not adding in the overall expenses in terms of housing like rent, a mortgage, taxes, income, food cost, car insurance, and other factors which all reduces ones ability to own a vehicle.

Sure maybe living in Kentucky it’s not an issue, but here? It’s a struggle for sure even for well off millennials it’s still hard.

This should be an eye opener for all.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/business/real-estate/story/2019-04-24/san-diego-popular-with-millennials-not-so-much-study-shows

Only 2 percent of millennials that move here to my city can afford to buy a house, that’s insane to me!

None of that changes the fact that the inflation adjusted cost of car ownership is less expensive now than it has ever been.

The relative high cost of living within certain locales has no bearing on this.

[64\/54Cadillacking]

None of that changes the fact that the inflation adjusted cost of car ownership is less expensive now than it has ever been.

The relative high cost of living within certain locales has no bearing on this.

But I think you have to add in those factors because it goes hand in hand with car ownership. It was much easier for a blue collar wage earner to own a house back in the 50’s and 60’s even in expensive states like CA and NY. Just having conversations with my parents regarding this topic confirms it.

Sure other cost for things have come down, but for the most part everything has become more expensive and wage growth in our nation has been stagnant for many years, yet new vehicle prices keep skyrocketing. We also live in “charge for everything” society, and easy financing is available so it may look like it’s easier for people to obtain expensive items such as a new vehicle, but it has also put many Americans is massive debt which is getting worse.

If one doesn’t factor in housing cost, you’re fooling yourself. If home and vehicle prices are rising hypothetical speaking, 6-8% a year or more, and your job is only giving a 1-2% raise a year how are you personally ever able to keep up and be able to afford new car prices and a home? Unless you’re well off and money is no factor, high inflation doesn’t affect you. It seems like the middle class is getting squeezed hard, and many young people today have to rely on help from others just to make ends meet. My parents and grandparents generation had it made, even they tell me, they were fortunate to grow up in a time where everything for the most part was within reach for the majority of society, not the few like it is now.

[James Landi]

Thank you Art for your personal insights.  Your narrative helps to refocus those influences and emotional impulses that cause us to engage in the car "hobby" in a balanced and healthy way.  Alas, I, for one, can be overwhelmed by emotional impulses that, at times, create a level of discomfort because I was spending money on "an old car" rather than a vintage car that was perceived by others as accruing in value.  You're correct--- young individuals have and many more, as they age, will find satisfaction in the car hobby--  Your advice is both comforting and wise. Thank you,   James

[Big Apple Caddy]

The overall cost of living on the coast for one thing hinders young people ability to afford to own a car. You’re not adding in the overall expenses in terms of housing like rent, a mortgage, taxes, income, food cost, car insurance, and other factors which all reduces ones ability to own a vehicle.

Sure maybe living in Kentucky it’s not an issue, but here? It’s a struggle for sure even for well off millennials it’s still hard.

Your comment that I had specifically replied to was implying that the cost of car ownership was the highest its ever been and I was pointing out that is simply not the case, at least not after adjusting for inflation.  While the costs of some things may have risen and more and more young people (and/or their parents) are spending money on things like college tuition, the average inflation adjusted operating/ownership costs of automobiles is actually down.  Down approximately 17% in constant dollars between 1998 and 2018, for example.

[Scot Minesinger]

On cost of ownership, such a used Cadillac, at 0.60 cents per mile, where much of that is depreciation that is not actually paid out (until car is sold), teenagers can afford it:

Work 20 hours a week at minimum wage, that is $150 gross, or $7,500 per year.  Net is going to be about $6,000, so let's say about $500 per month.  If they spent half their paycheck on a car, that allows for 250/0.6 = about 410 miles per month, 5,000 per year.  The problem with this calculation is generally they are driving older cars that require large repair bills and insurance payments may not be able to spread evenly over 12 months. 

I paid for all my children's car expenses from age 16 all through college (except gas during college years - not paying for road trips), and then they left the nest and were on their own.  This way they enjoyed the experience and education of owning a car.

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

But I think you have to add in those factors because it goes hand in hand with car ownership. It was much easier for a blue collar wage earner to own a house back in the 50’s and 60’s even in expensive states like CA and NY. Just having conversations with my parents regarding this topic confirms it.

Sure other cost for things have come down, but for the most part everything has become more expensive and wage growth in our nation has been stagnant for many years, yet new vehicle prices keep skyrocketing. We also live in “charge for everything” society, and easy financing is available so it may look like it’s easier for people to obtain expensive items such as a new vehicle, but it has also put many Americans is massive debt which is getting worse.

If one doesn’t factor in housing cost, you’re fooling yourself. If home and vehicle prices are rising hypothetical speaking, 6-8% a year or more, and your job is only giving a 1-2% raise a year how are you personally ever able to keep up and be able to afford new car prices and a home? Unless you’re well off and money is no factor, high inflation doesn’t affect you. It seems like the middle class is getting squeezed hard, and many young people today have to rely on help from others just to make ends meet. My parents and grandparents generation had it made, even they tell me, they were fortunate to grow up in a time where everything for the most part was within reach for the majority of society, not the few like it is now.

Maybe where you are real estate values are rising apace, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's a yardstick nationwide.

The average American lives beyond his means; the national savings rate in the United States is abysmal and this phenomenon exists at all income levels. I have little tolerance for those who complain incessantly about the predicament they find themselves due to their own poor choices and lack financial irresponsibility.

I have a friend who lives on his own and never having made over $20K, who in his early 30s managed to buy a near mint 42,000 mile 1999 Corvette for $15K cash while still having another daily driver. He saves like a madman, never bought a new car, never bought anything on credit while still maintaining a relatively comfortable lifestyle - while still having a decent chuck of money in the bank. A fancy vacation a year and a new car payment would mean bankruptcy for him.

I also daresay the average WWII generation had very different financial habits the average 20 - 30 something of today. And if the cost of living is too high in a given area to make ends meet, I guess the answer is to move.

As far as I'm concerned, the argument of how unaffordable car ownership is for the average working individual is nonsense.

[64\/54Cadillacking]

Maybe where you are real estate values are rising apace, but that is not necessarily mean it's a yardstick nationwide.

The average American lives beyond his means; the national savings rate in the United States is abysmal and this phenomenon exists at all income levels. I have little tolerance for those who complain incessantly about the predicament they find themselves due to their own poor choices and financial irresponsibility.

I have a friend who lives on his own and never having made over $20K, who in his early 30s managed to buy a near mint 42,000 mile 1999 Corvette for $15K cash while still having another daily driver. He saves like a madman, never bought a new car, never bought anything on credit while still maintaining a relatively comfortable existence - while still having a decent chuck of money in the bank. A fancy vacation a year and a new car payment would mean bankruptcy for him.

I also daresay the average WWII generation had very different financial habits the the average 20 - 30 something of today. And the cost of living is too high in a given area to make ends meet, I guess the answer is to move.

As far as I'm concerned, the argument of how unaffordable car ownership is for the average working individual is nonsense.

My point is, car ownership is prohibitively more expensive on the coasts than the rest of the country.

[cadillacmike68]

No kids, but all of my brothers and sisters and my wife's brothers and sisters have driver's licenses.

Only half of our nieces and nephews have DLs...

[Scot Minesinger]

Again, whether a 16 year earns a driver's license or not is up to the parents primarily.  It is not really a choice for the 16 year olds.  If parents let 16 year olds choose everything, then they might suffer unfortunate results.  Driving is costly, but earning a DL only (not driving theri own car) is not too expensive.  Not saying bad parents allow kids to not get DL's as circumstances may vary, but parents are the primary influence in this subject.

I do not know why people think it is up to a 16 year old to make super important parenting decisions.  All three of my children wanted to attend out of State colleges for no good reason, and I said no.  Then they went to great State schools for half the cost (which I paid for), did well, and got jobs - good parenting.