Why Cadillacs suck!...Comments expected and welcome!

[David #19063]

Hi Jim,

Yeah, sometimes I think there is a big black cloud...LOL!  Kind of like the Adams Family, lightning and all...LOL!

But honesty, although we have had our share of bad problems, more than most I feel.  

We have also been very fortunate in these situations as well.  My surviving the drunk driver that lost it at near 100 mph and hit me head on in my classic car...he died, killed two of his friends, put another in a coma for a while, injured his 4th friend...and nearly killed me.  However, severely injured, I survived.  Most bad encounters with speeding drunks leaves the victim dead and the drunk unscathed.  So, I was lucky.  I feel my family was luckier than many families that a drunk driver shatters their lives and kills their loved ones.

The Concours not starting Wednesday morning when we were leaving on our trip, happened in our driveway.  Not on our drive.  Not when I had the car out in the storm the night before, stopping at tire place to fix a leaking corroded chrome rim bead seal.  Not while my wife had the car up in Wisconsin the week before.  Not late at night, etc.  In some ways, we did good.

Plus, not any issues driving up here...but we feel it could be a waiting time bomb...LOL...waiting until we least expect it!

In fact, when the tow truck showed up, it started and stayed running, so I drove it to the shop 2 miles away.  It wasnt worth loading it on the flatbead.  But I gave the tow driver the tip I was going to give him for the tow (I ALWAYS) tip tow truck drivers (even thought I have AAA Plus) as he did come out.  He was young and it was drizzling out.  He was so blown away and happy.  "You made my day!"  He just appreciated that someone appreciated him and his day.

Many other things in our lives that have been bad or unpleasant...but realizing that in many of them...the timing of them was not at the worst time possible, but a manageable one.  They still sucked, but it could have been worse.

Bad things happen...timing, though, is what makes them easier or worse.

So, sometimes we feel rather charmed when we think about it.  

But hey!  Enough is enough!

LOL!

DAvid

[Porter 21919]

My last new Cadillac was a 93 ETC, only had it for 3 years 36K.

They had to replace a failed oxygen sensor engine device twice, other than that it was quite the nice ride. I sold the car to a friend of mine in 96, he had the rough engine problem from bad wires years later and the tranny failed at 100K. Last year a rough engine performance problem on acceleration was diagnosed as leaking head gaskets (coolant in exhaust or vice verse). Since the car has little value now they will just drive it in to the ground as is.

Otherwise his wife loved the car and drove it trouble free for many years.

Does anyone really expect a luxury car to give good service more than 10 years these days? Nothing is designed to last forever, although Henry Leland engineered his Cadillacs to be as bulletproof as could be.

We are in an entirely different world today with all the high tech bells and whistles, much of it unproven to withstand the test of time.

Much of it is high tech nonsense which distracts from your driving pleasure with numerous trips to the garage for repairs.

Per Davids 96 Concours problems I rest my case. The standard of the world must be the best, maybe the new Cadillacs are, GM is still recovering from the Roger B. Smith days IMHO. I knew people that owned a new Lexus 10 years ago, after many miles driven trouble free they felt it was the best car they ever owned.

We are the GM diehards, myself personally will never be seen driving a Japanese, German or Korean car, it is a matter of principal.

Porters 2 cents

[Art Archambeault CLC#22010]

         George, your comment has some merit, however, would one not trade in an old pair of glasses, scratched and broken for a new pair. With clear vision, mmmmm, one takes on new perspective.
Just a comment.   Art

[George]

Hi Art
I suppose if the original glasses had the aesthetic appeal of an old Cad, and the new ones were a Subaru. I would contact the glasses club page and learn to repair the old ones.

[JIM CLC # 15000]

03-25-05
David, I posted this story once, but it is good enough to repeat.
In spite of my better judgement, "sweety" had to have a Mercedes.
So, we got a 96 E320. It did just fine for the first 12k miles then strange things started to happen. As it were, we had at the same time an86 SDV "daily-driver", so it didnt matter much that the E320 became a "hanger-queen".
The E320 was still under warrenty. To make a "loong" story a little shorter, I told the shop to keep the car as long as they needed to in order to fix the problems. They had it about a week. Didnt make it home (about 10-12 miles) before the same problem crapped-up again.
Continued home, called and told shop to come get it and be sure it is fixed. After replacing just about all of the electric components and a 70 year computer,the factory reps. found that the problem was a "faulty ground".
Never had any more problems. Drove it until 2003 and it was still going good.
Good Luck, Jim

[Art Archambeault #22010]

  Hi George. I think I would agree. If the engine in my 49 quits
and I cant repair it for lack of money, I also , think I would keep it just for the aesthetics. Art

[Ralph clc20735]

Have loved the Caddys for years. Family had 74 coupe wich ran great. Got a 86 deville ht4.1 had new engine put in at 78k miles now has 197,000k miles. Bought a 97 Eldo ETC today it has 74,500 miles - it has had  lower and upper engine seals cost 4k and in september 2004 was told it needed 3k in repairs by local cad dealer including head gaskets. the white diamond paint is awesome looking no dings. for the cost of the repairs to keep it on the road I was able to buy a new lincoln town car. with warranty. The eldo sits in a warehouse next to my 41 cad, 67 eldo, 68 deville conv. which all run great....

[Randall McGrew CLC # 17963]

I have said this many times, that the history of the car and all those that went before to create a uniquely American Luxury Automobile.  It has had some drawbacks, poor management etc..  and god knows most every company has been destoryed by bean counters, not to mention the inexplicably greedy expectations of the Board Members, Share Holders and management.  

I have a great respect and love for history and the great things done in the past.  I recognise these can still happen, even though engineers are terribly hampered by business methods these days.  Harley Earl would not make it at GM these days.  And John DeLorean, genius though he may have been, was basically demoted in the 70s to being a team member on the Chevy Blazer development.  Obviously the bean counters did not think much of him.  

But one way we can all enjoy the history of Cadillacs is to enjoy the older cars when engineers developed innovated ways to create new cars, rather than computers and accountants.   Business is still business and if new cars are not selling, then the public is not buying....doing away with the unions and those nasty expensive health care policies for them (something the current administration is doing by disessembling what the New Deal created per the advice of conservative think tanks of the last 40 years) will raise corporate coffers, drive the body of workers into poorer and poorer condition, and increase the gulf between them.  I doubt the cars will get any better.

Personally, for what it is worth, I will own only one or two more cars that I hope will be old Cadillacs.  I cannot afford a new car on SSDI, and I do not like the overly complicated electronic equipment in the new cars because I cannot work on them.  A perfect example was my sons 2001 Chevy 3500 dually with a 454.  While on a long trip this last weekend the transmission failed to upshift into fourth gear reducing the mileage to less than 5 mpg!  The fault could be ANYWHERE, and no Chevy service center was open due to Easter.  sigh.
He kept muttering, if it were only a manual that kind of thing would not happen,  It was a long trip (1400 miles at 65 mph at best).  Normally carburated engines may be a hassel but I will take them anytime over fuel injection and computerization (and this from an old mainframe jockey no less).

Time is change, life is change...change is everywhere.  We cannot bring back the 50s (nor would I want to).  I simply enjoy the cars for what they were and are now.  We are all at the mercy of change.  I agree with the idea that cars have become people movers and will soon change into something totally utilitarian, much as they have become now, for service, reliability and disposability.  

If I can get my 1956 Caddy restored, I will use it until it dies, I die or both.
One thought though :  I wonder how long we will be allowed to drive cars that get so little miles per gallon in an age when petrolium is worth so much in the global political wars?  
All I can think to say is "Enjoy em while you got em. "

[Brian Daum, 18809]

From an European standpoint of view the negativity a lot of Americans have against their own home-built cars appears to be strange. Even here on our forum, where you would expect everyone to be Cadillac enthusiasts, there is a lot of negativity!

Everyone talkes about Mercedes, Toyato and Audi, how many 1959 Toyatos convertibles will cost $ 100,000 today, and how many members worldwide does the Audi Club have? (if there is any?).

Sure Mercedes builds a quality car, but you get what you pay for! I`m sure if Pontiac charged $ 75 000,- for a car they would build a lot more quality into their cars too. Anyway, living here in Europe, where the roads are crowded with all look-a-like soapbars, it seems to me they all have problems with transmissions and waterpumps and you name it.

I understand that the poor guy`s Cadillac is a lemon, but you gotta sometimes ask if these cars have been maintained according to the manufacturers specifications? Who takes time today changing brake fluid or engine coolant?

Sometime the American attitude appears to be "the grass is greener on the other side" No matter what, foreign must be better.. the wine is better, the cheese, the televisions, the cars, and here it comes from a foreigner... it`s not true!

If I ever become so lucky to reside in the States, I am sure what I`ll be driving...... A CADILLAC!

Brian
Norway

[David #19063]

Hello Brian,

Well, the negativity comes from what I have stated already about the situation.  The car seems to be needing another digital dash.  It has had two replacements already.  This will be the 3rd.  This one I will have to pay for...but then again, the 2nd one was replaced under the extended warranty I had to purchase for $1600...so I guess I did pay for that one too!

The car has only 103,000 miles on it.  It has been pampered, serviced, and garaged its whole life.  We have owned the car since it had 27,000 miles and was 2 1/2 years old.  We also have all the service records, ours and the previous owners.  (He was retired, had a new 94 Concours, traded it on this new 96 Concours, then traded our car in and bought a 98 Lexus 400...I wonder what he drives now?).  Obviously, there are issues with the digital dash.  Factory defect.

I also think that it needing two fuel pumps before 55,000 miles is excessive as well.  Not to mention plugs and wires at 81,000 on a "tune ups every 100,000 miles".

But what frustrates me is when something simple like the trunk pull down goes bad and the dealer wants $312 for the part when more than likely, they get it from the supplier for proably less than $10.  The dealer should not be charging more than $50 for it.  Look at the part, it is simple, should be inexpensive.

Now, I have not owned a Mercedes, but I hear they have some serious maintenance issues themselves.  A friend of mine, she has a S600 and a ML500 for her company cars.  The get her new ones about every 2-3 years.  She says theyre in the shop so much she will never get a Mercedes.  She has owned a new Jeep, a new Turbo Audi, and a now a Hemi Magnum and they have had very little problems compared to the Mercedes.

I do not think that I ever stated that the grass was greener anywhere else.

My issue is that with the current technology, car manufactures should be standing behind there quality much longer...without the buying public having to purchase extented warranties.  And the brutal cost of repairs when the quality is poor.

As far as there not being a 59 Toyota convertible worth $100,000...that is irrevelant.  There were very very few 59 Eldorado conv. built.  There are only a few now.  I can guaranty that far and away most people on this board cannot afford a $100,000 toy such as one of these.  

In fact, I am sure most people on this board do not buy brand new Cadillacs...a loaded V8 STS is what, about $67,000, and a STS-V even more.  I think my post asking people what cars they own, newer and classics, showed that.

So, a lot of us drive classic Cadillacs (and other makes) because we like them and they are cool in our eyes.  

And some of us buy 2-3 year old Cadillacs because they depreciate so fast and they can be afforded.  And some of us purchase 7-15 year old Cadillacs because we can only afford them.

Yes, used cars will have some issues, but when there is a repetative quality issue in these cars, we get frustrated and discuss these issues.

I am sure Cadillac has soured many people with their electronic shocks that were near $800/each when they were available.  That is just not right for a car manufacturer to do.  (In my opinion...especially if we truely knew what Cadillac paid for them in the first place.)

If Cadillac (or any other car manufacturer) cannot produce a good quality low trouble car, then at least they should sell the repair parts for cheap.  Not make a poor quality car and then charge exorbinate price for repair parts.  Like the $414 fuel pump for a 96 Cadillac and another $220 to install it...what a crime.

Yes, the US is a great place...however, there is always room for improvements to be made...in our American made cars and in America itself.  

I hope you get a chance to visit here sometime.

When I was in college, I had a big poster of a fjord in Norway right above my bed...one day I would like to visit your country and see the beauty there.  And through the CLC I met Bruce & Bronwyn and my family also wants to visit Tasmania as well.  

And of course there are many other places in the world Id like to see.  Heck, ther are many places here in the US that Id like to see as well...The Redwoods and the Giant Sequoias to name some.

We are Cadillac enthusiasts here on this board.  But, me thinks, "*****ing and moaning" is a common US passtime (maybe even considered a sport) that many of us enjoy...LOL!

David

[David #19063]

Porter,

Yes, we like it.  Like I wrote on another thread, it got 25.0 mpg on the highway at 75+ mph, it has a V8 and it is powerful.  

Roomy and safe...the only safer car built in 96 (according to the Insurance Institute crash data) is the long wheel base S-class, however, the short wheel base S-class was not as safe as the DeVille.

I can have the drivers seat comfortable for me and an adult can sit in the back seat and I do not have to move mine for them to have leg room.

It handles well and is very comfortable on short and long drives.

We are just concerned about it (or other nearly new cars)  being a ticking financial time bomb with repairs.

David

[Brian Daum, 18809]

Hi David,

I am sure you are quite frustrated with your car and the cost of keeping it roadworthy, but no matter how you see it a complex car like a newer Cadillac is going to have more components that malfunction. The most sensible choice in cars would be a 1960`s Chevy with a 350 before the emmision control set in. These cars have cheap parts, easy to service and are quite comfortable. But anyway I would do exactly the same thing you have done if I lived in the US, buy a few years old Cadillac and then bleed paying for parts.

But is there any car brand these days with cheap parts, my wifes Hando stopped suddenly, and the Hando serviceman said that the only way to go was to change the entire distributor at the cost of $ 1100,-!!!! For that money I could buy a complete distributor for a Chevy and have a 2 weeks cruise in the Caribbean.

We live on the NW Coast of Norway, undoubtly one of prettiest places on Earth, strong words, but yes, nature here is breathtaking, the West Coast of Norway was voted as the Worlds Best Place of Tourism by National Geographic last year. And what backgrounds for Cadillacs! Yes, we have lots of Cadillacs, everything from 1920`s elegant cars, finned 50`s to elegant 60`s.

If there is any CLC member on vacation in the area I`ll be more than happy to give you the complete tour!!


Regards

Brian

PS. I never seem to get these Japanese names right, Toyato, Hando, Mitsabashi, whatever......

[Todd Rothrauff]

Hello Brian,

If you think parts for your Cadillac cost a lot, here are a few parts prices for some various Ford products:

*  Outer CV boot kit for a Ford Probe- $98.00 per side
*  Ignition control module for the same Probe - approx. $700 (Probe owners who encounter a Crank/No Start condition can have $1200 in fixing this)
*  Mark VIII with a headlamp inop - better hope it doesnt have HID - $ 750 per side

My point is that Cadillac is not alone when it comes to high dealer parts prices.  I know someone who owns a Ferrari 348.  He wanted to replace the oil fill cap.  When the receipt for the $180 he had to spend for this cap came to his desk, he took a deep breath, retrieved the old cap, framed it and hung it on his garage wall.

The era of the simply engineered, easy to fix automobile is over, thanks to Government regulations (CAFE, Emissions, FMVSS, etc.).  These regulations require the use of extremely sophisticated electronics in order to ensure compliance.

The modern automobile is more reliable, is more efficient and performs better than its older counterparts - Fact, Period, End of Story. It is the aformentioned hi-tech engineering that enables these cars to do the things they do.  Yes, new cars have some issues (every manufacturer has them).  But, as a whole, quality is far superior than in the past.  

Having said all that, I would love to trade my 1996 Mark VIII for an old Cadillac or Lincoln.  There are some qualities the old cars had that the new cars cannot duplicate.  They may be hard to define, but we all know them when we see them.  This is why we love to drive them.

Todd

[Johnny]

Yes you are right, oveall, todays cars are more reliable, and require less maintainance, and possibly in the long run the cost can be somewhat "reasonable".  Thats all well and good for those that can buy new cars every 3-5 years, but how about those millions of Americans that buy only "used cars"?  Look at the dilemna they face!  They usually buy cars that are out of warranty, and face very large repair bills, unless they buy some sort of extended warranty.

[Bruce Reynolds # 18992]

Gday Johnny,

You are right there.   I usually buy a car that is at least ten years old, as it is about that time that I can afford to buy.   No new stuff for me.

The biggest killer with the new cars is the requirement to have so much electronics to enable the vehicle to pass all the Federally required statutes.

Another problem with todays cars is the vast use of plastics to keep weight down.   This, again is to ebnable compliance of Federal restrictions and fuel economy laws.

Gone are the days of the "simple" car that can be fixed with a shifter, hammer, screwdriver, and a pair of pliers to cut off a piece of fencing wire to keep going.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le),
60 CDV

[JIM CLC # 15000]

03-28-05
Correct me if Im wrong, but it seems I either read or heard on TV that Cadillac has a 100k warrenty on their "certified & inspected" used cars!
I hope I wasnt dreaming!
Good Luck, Jim

[Johnny]

03-28-05
Correct me if Im wrong, but it seems I either read or heard on TV that Cadillac has a 100k warrenty on their "certified & inspected" used cars!
I hope I wasnt dreaming!
Good Luck, Jim

I doubt that Cadillac has that.  I did a quick search, and a company offers an extended warranty with 100k.  Heres the site:

http://www.theautoclub.com/warranty/plans/coverage_universal_platinum.jsp TARGET=_blank>http://www.theautoclub.com/warranty/plans/coverage_universal_platinum.jsp

[Ed Dougher]

Perhaps, but the Mazda has electronic multiport fuel injection, a 4 speed electronically controlled automatic transmission, power windows, power locks, cruise control, power mirrors, A/C, cassette stereo, etc., etc., and it hasnt experienced electrical problems.

By reputation, Lexus or Acura owners dont seem to experience many problems with their cars, and theyre certainly state-of-the-art.

[Rusty Shepherd CLC 6397]

I dont understand Consumer Reports reliability reports. A certain car can have above-average and much above-average scores in every category (engine,electrical,etc)and still have an overall worse-than-average reliability rating. For the last two annual auto issues, they address this issue saying it is the question that they get asked most often. Their explanation is that some of the categories are weighed more heavily than others and even with the above-average scores, a certain vehicle can still be considered less than reliable when compared to the average of that year model vehicle. If that is the case, then I think each category should have to pass that standard. In my opinion, a vehicle with all above-average ratings in all categories should not be rated below-average overall.

[BOB SPRINGER CLC#19089]

DAVID, I HAVE A 1951 CDV AND DONT HAVE ANY OF THESE PROBLEMS.  I THINK ALL NEW CARS ARE CRAP AND WILL NEVER LAST AS LONG AS OUR OLD ONES.  GOOD LUCK BOB