Searching for 1959 Cadillac Eldorado Biarritz-Need Advice

[AMERIKANISCH]

I am seriously considering buying a '59 Caddy Biarritz. I am 63 and think that it is time to indulge a bit. Obviously, this is a big investment and I don't want to get skinned. I am looking at it both as a fun car to drive on weekends and an investment. To make sure I am not overpaying, what should I be looking for? Please be detailed and specific.

Also, this is the information on a Fisher Body Plate: Style: 59-6467
Body FW ?      625 ?
Trim 11B ?      Paint 90?
OP 1B Acc. EH   

I know what the Style means, but what does the rest mean?

Thanks!

B. Stewart

[wrefakis]

that is an Olympic white black bucket seat car,I would suggest a very detailed close up professional examination of that vehicle,it has been around a bit

[AMERIKANISCH]

The car is white with white bucket seats. Whom should I get to look at it?
The car is in Birmingham Ala. I am in California.
I am not ready to buy it tomorrow- just doing my research.
They were asking $199,000- price lowered to $165,000- still a whole lot of money.
They are advertising A/C but I don't see the A/C.
I don't think they know what it has.
Not very professional if you ask me.
If the car would be a good investment is the only way that I could justify such a high price.
Which is why I cannot overpay.

Here is a car that I am checking out:

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/dealer/cadillac/eldorado_biarritz/1649123.html

What do you think?

[C.R. Patton II]

Hello B. Stewart

Welcome to the Cadillac & LaSalle Club Forum.

I would suggest the following BEFORE acquisition:
(1) Join the CLC National organization and a region near your residence
(2) Attend and participate in your local region meetings and events with an inquisitive friendly persona
(3) Attach your ear to the individuals that have own or have experience with the model you desire
(4) Read Cadillacs of the Fifties by Roy Schneider
(5) Honestly assess your skill level and finances versus the purchase, maintenance, and operating costs.

Be a conscientious buyer by doing your own homework.  To achieve one of your lifelong goals of possessing this Cadillac should not frustrate and ruin the remaining days of your life.  We exist to assist.

[Coupe Deville]

That car did not come with A/C out of the factory according to the body tag.

[AMERIKANISCH]

Thank you CR. I appreciate your assistance. It looks like you a re heading me in the right direction.
I live in Orange County, Ca. Laguna Niguel, to be exact. Is there a chapter nearby?

Also, although I do consider the Caddy a nice reward for a successful life, I would not want to spend an outrageous amount on maintenance and operating costs.
It would be a fun weekend car and a car to show at informal car shows occasionally. I seriously doubt if I will get into showing at Pebble Beach Concours and winning the 100 point trophy- but who knows? I guess it could happen- but I doubt it.

Thanks again!

B. Stewart

[AMERIKANISCH]

Thank you, Coupe De Ville. Can you tell me anything else from the Body Tag?

B. Stewart

[AMERIKANISCH]

C.R.,

I just checked out Schneider's book on the 50s Cadillacs on Amazon. $220 for a used book? REALLY???

I am hoping that if I join your club you will have it in your library for lending to members for a reasonable charge.

B. Stewart

[Coupe Deville]

Letter E is tinted glass, and H is heater.

[C.R. Patton II]

Mr. Stewart

This is not a hobby for the poor or timid but the conscientious.

The Cadillacs of the Fifties is written by CLC Member Roy Schneider.  He is an incomparable author of numerous automtive books.  This gentleman painstakingly completed research on ALL of the Cadillac models for that DECADE so you and I can absorb.
The reason for the price is twofold.  It is out of print and in demand.
 
I hope this information dissipates your trepidation to purchase and increase your knowledge.  The vehicle you have chosen is a fine example of the Standard of the World.  As a graduate of the University of Southern California I can testify that spending good money to learn is money well spent. 

There are other automobile brands with bad quality and inexpensive products that may be commiserate to your objectives.

[wrefakis]

In the ad it states TMU=true miles unknown, the body tag has been replaced with incorrect rivets
Car comes from the east coast,so you will need to know you way around paint and bodywork to judge quality of work that has been done

[Smedly]

C.R, I strongly disagree with you statement that this is not a hobby for the poor. This hobby has room for ALL. not just the rich and famous. I have several Cadillac books and would never consider spending that kind of money on one, I understand the time and effort that went into its construction however that would be money I could place else where. Perhaps a authenticity manual would be a good purchase to start with so Mr. Stewart could be sure what he looks at is Authentic. And maybe it is more in the budget. Or even a less expensive 59 book, I am sure there are others on the market. One can enjoy the hobby more if they stay within their means.
Sheldon Hay

[AMERIKANISCH]

C.R.,

  I am far from "poor" ...LOL. But spending $220 for a book is like spending $5 for a stick of chewing gum. Maybe you can afford it- but WOWIE!!!! I drive a Mercedes SL65 AMG as my daily driver. If I can afford to maintain it, I think that I can afford to maintain the Caddy.

  Anyway, if the book is not available in any library, I very well may decide to purchase a copy. But if I can even look at the book in a library long enough to photocopy the proper pages, that would be preferable.

  Perhaps my enthusiasm is not up to your standards yet, C.R., but I am just a newbie after all.

B. Stewart

[AMERIKANISCH]

Smedley,

Thank you for your down-to-earth comments.

B. Stewart

[wrefakis]

there is nothing in the book that will help you,post your questions here after researching every know survivor over the last 35 years, I can answer any questions you may have

[chrisntam]

Here's my 2 cents.  Find the right car for the right money.  The right car is going to be a lot more expensive than one of lesser quality.  I highly suggest you buy the car in a completed and restored condition.  Finding (the right) parts is tough, time consuming and expensive.  You do have to do your homework (or align yourself with someone very knowledgeable or a find a very reputable dealer) to know what you're looking at.  That's where books come in or join the local Cadillac club and immerse yourself with others who have made the journey you are about to embark on.  Absorb all they have to offer and ask questions.  I posted many questions on several websites and got a lot of help.  I purchased an owners manual and factory service manual even before buying the car I was looking for.  The owners manual was especially helpful.  So I think the idea is to have a period of "gathering knowledge" to "know what you're looking at" and then when the time is right, "pull the trigger" and enjoy the ride!

As said earlier, the data plate has the incorrect rivets (I had no idea), but why was the data plate removed?  Is that normal for it to be removed during a restoration or is something else going on? Does the car have all the correct parts?  If it were me, my must have options would be cruise control and air conditioning.  Even though it's a top down car, it's nice to have it and it is more desirable than a non a/c car (my opinion).  Cruise control would be for the road trips!

I have always liked the 1960 convertible, but couldn't afford one.  I settled for a 1970 convertible.  I looked for more than a year for the right one. I flew a thousand miles to personally inspect it to be sure it was as represented.  I ended up buying it.  It was the right color, had the right options I wanted and was in relatively good condition (I ended up going through the engine and put another $10k or so in it).  By doing my homework and being patient, I found a car that wasn't butchered up or pieced together or missing parts.  As old as these cars are, and as many hands as they pass through, there is a lot of opportunity to have stuff altered, which is not good.

I bought Schneider's book on "Cadillacs of the Sixties" just because the '69 is very close to a '70.  The book has tons of black and white pictures and lots of information about options and provides details on each model for a particular year.  It's not a book you'll sit down and read from cover to cover, it's more of a reference book.  There is no real text to read, but lots of pictures (3 to 6 pictures per page along with a caption for each picture).  No paragraphs, just tons of captions and pictures (at least the Cadillac of the Sixties book).  I ponied up around $90.00 for my book.

So there ya go.  Best of luck to you on your quest, half the fun is the hunt.  And it's a journey, not a destination!

chris.

[76eldo]

I have all three books that Roy did.  Yes, there is great information there, but basically these books have the same technical info that can be found in the sales literature and dealer data books for each year.  If you spend enough time on the web, using google, you can get the information.

There is a lot of knowledge here, and Bill Refakis is an expert on the 59.

By the way, if the trim tag was removed and put on a different cowl with incorrect rivets, the car might be rebodied.  The frame number and the engine number as well as the trim tag have to be scrutinized in order to make sure that this or any car is actually an Eldorado.

Get any car you are considering inspected by someone who knows the car.  Better to spend $500.00 on a proper inspection than risk getting stuck with a bad car.

Brian

[AMERIKANISCH]

Wrefakis,

  Could the body tag have been removed in preparation for painting and perhaps reattached with new and improper rivets?

   By the way, these sellers never got back to me with the answers to my questions as promised. I think they are rather unprofessional. After all, they seemed not to know that their car does not have A/C. Even I could figure that out and I am only now becoming acquainted with the car.

  I looked at a '59 Eldo Biarritz at a broker's warehouse in Costa Mesa. The broker showed me where the vin number was stamped low in the engine compartment but the numbers were badly worn and not entirely discernible. Seems odd..... I mean..... what would make the numbers wear down in a non-friction environment under the hood?

I have come to the conclusion that it is very easy to get fooled in my quest. I would rather pay a bit more and get a car that has proper documentation. I saw a green one that looked like a "one" but they want $220,000. Seems a bit pricey and I am not all that fond of green anyway (the perfect white interior helped, though).

[AMERIKANISCH]

Guys,

  Please provide information on the time and place regarding the closest meeting spot to Laguna Niguel, Ca.(south Orange County).

  Thanks!

  B. Stewart

[AMERIKANISCH]

Chris,

   The 1970 Caddy is just about the most beautiful car ever produced in my estimation. If I were going for beauty, I would get the '69 or '70- Especially the front end- an absolute work of art. But I wanted to go for flamboyance. If I had room in my garage, I'd go for beauty too. But we have three Mercedes' and a truck and the truck sits out because we only have a three car garage. If I get the Caddy, I will garage it and leave my Mercedes outside- but covered. Wish I had more room.

  Anyway, what made you decide for the '70 over the '69? As a collector, I would have thought it might be best to go for the first year of the body style.