1953 Autronic Eye

[Cadman53]

Does anyone know what the part # is for the power relay on the Autronic Eye system.  Everyone I see online is for a 6 volt car.  Mine is a 12 volt and the Power Relay on the car now is #5944038 and has 12 volt stamped on it.  I cannot find a replacement with that #.  Low beams do not work and that seems to be the problem. Any ideas?

[Carfreak]

http://graylady.atwebpages.com/Specs.htm

Autronic Eye Power Relay - 5945189  (Replaces) 5944038)

Might try Fusick?  Listed on in their NOS Parts list last summer:

5945189 Autronic Eye Power Relay 1953-58 all 65.00

https://www.fusickautomotiveproducts.com/images/early%20NOS%20list%208.23.2023.pdf
(top of page 4)

[Cadman53]

I appreciate the information.  I have been looking at that Part# all over the internet.  Every time I follow it ,it turns out to be for a 6 volt system.  Mine says 12 volt.  I just cannot seem to figure out why the #5945189 is 6 volt but my # is 12 volt.  Maybe Fusick can help!!!

[Carfreak]

I'm also seeing 5945189 as 12v as seen here:   https://www.ebay.com/itm/174251006354

[J. Gomez]

Does anyone know what the part # is for the power relay on the Autronic Eye system.  Everyone I see online is for a 6 volt car.  Mine is a 12 volt and the Power Relay on the car now is #5944038 and has 12 volt stamped on it.  I cannot find a replacement with that #.  Low beams do not work and that seems to be the problem. Any ideas?

R. Fratt,

Power Relay 594 4038 was replaced by 594 5189 on 10/1/1953 as Carfrak stated above.

594 4038 was used on the first release of the Autronic-Eye amplifier units on the 1953 12V systems, on later updated amplifiers models 594 5189 was used instead and older models of the amplifiers would require modifications if the 594 5189 was used.

I do not believe there were too many early models of Autronic-Eyes with the 594 4038 installed on the 1953 Cadillac as the change occur with amplifiers starting with serial #55342159, so you maybe the lucky (or unlucky) person having the early unit.   

Question, do you hear the relay activation between the HB to LB? If "YES" then the relay is working however the contacts inside maybe loose/bad/corroded to switch over to the LB when energized.   

You could try opening the power relay and see the condition of the relay/contacts these power relays were prone to loose contacts the way they were designed.   

Good luck..!

[Cadman53]

Thanks a lot J.  That is exactly what I was looking for.  I will try to get a look inside and if that doesn't work then I will buy one of the newer models.  That is exactly what the relay is doing.  When you switch to low beam, the relay will click but lights do not work.  If you tap the relay the lights will come on.  Ain't technology great? Maybe hire a troll to sit under the hood and tap the relay at nighttime.  Wonder what they cost? LOL

[J. Gomez]

Maybe hire a troll to sit under the hood and tap the relay at nighttime.  Wonder what they cost? LOL

It all depends on shift the troll will be working on to tap the relay.   

Thanks a lot J.  That is exactly what I was looking for.  I will try to get a look inside and if that doesn't work then I will buy one of the newer models.  That is exactly what the relay is doing.  When you switch to low beam, the relay will click but lights do not work.  If you tap the relay the lights will come on. 

I did not have the luck on working on the older units but I did work on the later ones AC version 1955-1958 (early 1958 HV type) and for the power relay I was able to fit a small auto cube relay (SPDT) inside the same metal enclosure after removing everything off.

Since the changes made to the amplifier was removing one resistor and adding a new one at a different location for the replacement power relay, I'm not sure if that would need to be done on your amplifier "IF" a new auto cube relay is used in your application.    The modification was needed with the newer power relay replacement due to the LB getting stuck "on" with the 594 5189 with the older amplifiers.

Good luck..!

[Cadman53]

So I guess you are saying that the #5945189 power supply cannot be used on the old amplifier unless it is modified?  Know where I can find a #5944038 power supply?  Maybe you know someone that can modify my old amplifier with the new stuff.  I took the old power relay apart and cleaned it up but now it will not click anymore.  It acts like the coil finally gave up the ghost.  Do you know how to just disconnect the autronic eye and just get the low/high beam to work?  Want to sell the car but not with headlights not working. I would prefer to sell it to someone with the headlights working properly. LOL

[TonyZappone #2624]

When I bought this Florida winter home app. 25 years ago, there was an old time mechanic up in Stuart that worked on my cars.  He was quite elderly, and passed shortly after that.  After the war, he came down from up North and opened a big shop in Miami.  He was very critical of the early Autronic Eye units. He laughingly commented one day "....those cars with Autronic Eye, the garages sometime burned down the night after they worked on them...."  I had them on a couple of cars, I disconnected them or shut them off, I forget now how that was done
 

[J. Gomez]

So I guess you are saying that the #5945189 power supply cannot be used on the old amplifier unless it is modified?  Know where I can find a #5944038 power supply?  Maybe you know someone that can modify my old amplifier with the new stuff.  I took the old power relay apart and cleaned it up but now it will not click anymore.  It acts like the coil finally gave up the ghost.  Do you know how to just disconnect the autronic eye and just get the low/high beam to work?  Want to sell the car but not with headlights not working. I would prefer to sell it to someone with the headlights working properly. LOL

Before you jump into the very $$$ abyss looking for a 594 4038 replacement, I would suggest checking yours first hand.

These power relays are a bit tricky in the way they are setup, you can bench check yours by testing the coil continuity with a volt-ohm meter or a test light.

The coil terminals are the "C" (positive side) and the metal chassis of the relay cover (ground), if your meter shows continuity (ohms scale or continuity setting) you are good. Also the relay cover would need to have a good ground connection sometime this may not the case.

If the test above fails you can try setting a "cheap"  cube SPDT relay in place and see if that switches the UB over to LB. The connection for this type of relay is;
Terminal 86 to ground and terminal 85 to wire from "C" terminal.
Terminal 30 from the headlight switch +12V.
Terminal 87a to the HB wire and terminal 87 to the LB wire.

If the Autronic-Eye switches between UB-LB-UB with no issues you maybe be fine with replacing the power relay with the 594 5189 but  . Looking at the changes that was made to the amplifier it seems the newer relay is more sensitive that is why it got stuck on the LB after the amplifier released it to the UB.

Good luck..!

[J. Gomez]

When I bought this Florida winter home app. 25 years ago, there was an old time mechanic up in Stuart that worked on my cars.  He was quite elderly, and passed shortly after that.  After the war, he came down from up North and opened a big shop in Miami.  He was very critical of the early Autronic Eye units. He laughingly commented one day "....those cars with Autronic Eye, the garages sometime burned down the night after they worked on them...."  I had them on a couple of cars, I disconnected them or shut them off, I forget now how that was done
 

Tony,

That is possible if someone mess with the wiring/connection to and from these units, there are very high voltages from the amplifier over to the phototube (600-1000 VDC or 300-800 VAC). I have seen amplifiers with all inside wiring burnt-up as it someone may had reversed the high voltage wiring.   

I know there is/was an error listed on the 1956 Service Manual wiring diagram which cause a short if on the 12V source and this was later corrected on the January 1956 Serviceman publication.

Disabling the Autronic-Eye is simple removing the +12V (light blue) at the amplifier and leaving everything in place would do it, BUT again the power relay would need to be in good working order for the headlights to switch. If the amplifier is disable the second foot switch (aka auxiliary switch) will not work since it momentarily operates the amplifier to switch.

[Cadman53]

Thanks everyone for all of the information.  I continued to work with the original power relay and WALA!!. The headlights work as advertised now.  Hope that relay does not ever go bad!  Guess I am one of the lucky souls that still has one of those original Autronics that works.  Thanks again!

[Carfreak]

Jose to the rescue, again. 

[J. Gomez]

Jose to the rescue, again. 

Thanks Carfreak, just helping out a Cadillac owner that is why we are here.   

[bcroe]

I know there is/was an error listed on the 1956 Service Manual wiring diagram which cause a short if on the 12V source and this was later corrected on the January 1956 Serviceman publication.

I am amazed at the number of errors I find in wiring
diagrams, does not anyone realize how important it
is to get these right? 

Someone (NOT ME) ought to build a solid state board
that connects to the photo tube and replaces all
the rest.  Automatically adapting to 6V or 12V. 

My ideal fix would be a mechanical adapter that just
has a mechanical dimmer switch coupled to the turn
signal lever as in later cars, throw away those floor
buttons and everything else.  Bruce Roe

[Lexi]

Years ago this was offered on Ebay. An Autronic Eye transistor unit. Wonder if it was ever resurrected and is still available somewhere? Clay/Lexi

[J. Gomez]

Someone (NOT ME) ought to build a solid state board
that connects to the photo tube and replaces all
the rest.  Automatically adapting to 6V or 12V. 

Bruce Roe

So the amplifier was already reversed engineer by Barry L. Dorr from Dorr Engineering Services Inc. for the 12V with a retrofit board but keep the same phototube, so the board still produced the high voltages for the original phototube. What I'm not sure is how well these board where marketable back them. 

The issue is not that simple since the first generation (both amplifiers and phototubes) where DC version while the later ones where AC version, so his conversion board was exclusive for the AC versions.

My ideal fix would be a mechanical adapter that just
has a mechanical dimmer switch coupled to the turn
signal lever as in later cars, throw away those floor
buttons and everything else.  Bruce Roe

The Autronic-Eye reacts similar to the modern automatic-headlights in some GM models which switches the low beams to high on dark roads and back when there is an incoming light source. So the foot switch/switches in this case are just to switch the amplifier on/off or to momentarily disable the unit once is active if desired.

So what is old back them, is new now. 

[J. Gomez]

Years ago this was offered on Ebay. An Autronic Eye transistor unit. Wonder if it was ever resurrected and is still available somewhere? Clay/Lexi

Clay,

Those were an add-on kits made in Japan as an option, they could not be retrofitted into the older Autronic-Eye option. 

[Lexi]

Well good you chimed in. I thought they were a replacement for the under the hood box.  Thanks Jose. Clay/Lexi

[bcroe]

The amp is a slam dunk, getting 1000VDC from 6V or 12V
is a little harder.  Did the solid state board source
disappear? Was the 6V a negative ground system? 

I do not know what the AC and DC versions are? Bruce Roe