41 60 special solenoid

[mr41cadillac]

 bill  here are pictures of the solenoid on my 41 60 now. the number is 929-6----- and that's all that's  visable. the starter is 1107-6 ------ all numbers that are visable.  the starter we think is ok. we took the solenoid apart and cleaned contacts etc but don't think its the best. the car will click click then maybe start every now and then. if we bypass it starts everytime.  so is my starter correct? and if so what if any other solenoid will work ? any help appreciated

[Paul Phillips]

John
There is an internal relay in the solenoid in addition to the main contact plate that feeds the starter motor.  Those are known to have problems, and will prevent the solenoid from properly energizing, which means the main contacts won't make properly either.  A local auto electric shop should be able to help on that.

Paul

[Bill Ingler #7799]

John: As Paul has already said, the solenoid relay is probably the biggest source of starter problems. I think your starter is fine but your solenoid relay is the problem. Picture 1 is a solenoid relay from a 1542 solenoid. In your previous posting you said you could not get the ammeter to show a charge. The first thing I would check is do I have the correct wires attached to the correct posts on the ammeter? Picture 2 below shows the back of the instrument cluster from your car and the back of the ammeter. The number 1 is pointing to the ammeter post that should be the connect post for the 10 gage wire coming from the starter solenoid. The number 2 is pointing to the post that connects the 10 gage wire that comes from the BAT post of the voltage regulator. It could be you have these two wires reversed on the ammeter. I am also assuming that with all the electrical work you have done on the electrical system that you polarized the generator before you started the car for the first time.     Bill

[mr41cadillac]

thanks no bill we did not polarize on the 1st crank on maybe the third. also we reversed the wires to the ammeter. made no difference. I'm going out right now to make sure the ammeter wires are as you said. will post again in a few minutes.

[mr41cadillac]

bill I reversed as they were wrong and its charging. !!!!!!!!!!  the gage shows only a slight charge but I have a fully charged optima battery. also I need to tighten my generator belt. I cranked 4 times and cranked fine with no clicking, but I do need another solenoid or an alternative. thanks a lot john

[Bill Ingler #7799]

John: Glad you got the charge. A word of caution on the Optima battery. If you ever need to charge the Optima with a regular 6 volt battery charger, disconnect the charger IMMEDIATLEY as soon as the Optima battery shows full charge. Over charging an Optima can kill the battery. I purchased a Battery Tender that puts out 1 amp and attached the ring connectors to the battery cables. So any time the car is parked in the garage. the Battery Tender is plugged into the car.    Bill

[Bob Schuman]

John,
I'm not sure what you have, because I do not find any similar solenoid part number in my MPB, and the only similar starter number is for 1953 and later 12 volt starters. The photo looks like a 1950 and later solenoid, that does not use the relay.
1940 through 1949 starter solenoids have a relay mounted on top of the solenoid, and this type must be used on a pre 1950 car.
The 40-49 design with the relay passes a small electrical current through the ignition switch and the starter button to energize the relay. It, in turn, closes its contacts to pass a heavy current that the solenoid requires. In 1950, the ignition switch, starter button, and wiring were redesigned to handle the heavy sloenoid current directly and the relay was not used.
If your solenoid is the later type without the relay, using it with the original ignition switch and starter button will in a fairly short time burn the contacts in one or both of those devices, causing them to fail.  No good news, but you need to be aware of this.
Bob Schuman

[mr41cadillac]

thanks bob i will pass this on to my friend. he had said he thought that a solenoid from a 1950-1954 chevy was the same. john

[Steve Passmore]

thanks bob i will pass this on to my friend. he had said he thought that a solenoid from a 1950-1954 chevy was the same. john

That may be what you have on there already but its nothing like the solenoid that should be on there.
This site has a starter listed. Don't know if they still have it though?

http://www.1941cadillacparts.com/current-1941-cadillac-parts-inventory.html

[mr41cadillac]

BOB SO IT SOUNDS LIKE I HAVE A 12 VOLT STARTER ? we thought we would take the starter off and order a solenoid for an early 50s chevy and see if its the same. anyhow ive cranked the car 8 times and she cranks with no clicking and just fine. but as you say it will burn the contacts out.  could another solution be to add a solenoid on the firewall and connect it to the starter ?

[Bob Schuman]

John,
First, I am assuming your 41 is still operating on its 6 volt electrical system. If that is correct, I don't think you have a 12 volt starter, as it would crank very poorly if at all when being fed only 6 volts. Cadillac, Olds, and the Buick V-8 models went to 12 volts in 1953, while Chevrolet and Pontiac stayed with 6 volts through 1954 models. I think the 53 Buick Special with the old straight eight was the last 6 volt Buick.

Without learning about the wiring of Ford models that used a remote solenoid, I'm afraid to comment on whether that would be any different electrically than what you have now.  Why not just locate a good 42-49 Cadillac solenoid assembly and heve the system work like its original design? The 42-49 design is more common than the 40-41 design, therefore easier to find, and they are interchangeable. Steve Cooley in Florida is one possible supplier who has a lot of stuff for old Cadillacs.
Bob Schuman

[Chris Davis]

A general note of caution on 1941CadillacParts.com     I am still waiting on parts paid for in February with excuse after excuse for the delay.