My 57 Fleetwood restorations photos with questions.

[57flw]

and a couple more.



I am now just waiting on a replacement Vacuum Pump to arrive so I can fit it to the oil pump and complete the Engine Assembly and then use some of that new Cadillac Blue paint I got hold of.

The cylinder head problem I reported earlier has now been rectified.
I acquired two good replacement heads from Witchita Falls, TX.

I have just moved to a new house I purchased on three acres and had to move all the Caddy parts, piece by piece. This is not something I would like to do again.
I now need to build another shed to accomodate my hoist.

Ken

[57flw]

Engine almost complete now that the replacement Vacuum pump has arrived.

Now for the water pump. No use doing all this work without doing up the water pump.

My car was originally No Air Con.

When I aquired all the Air bits and pieces I also got, amoung other things, the radiator and water pump out of the air con donor car.

Well the two pumps look the same to me except one has a couple of long pipes attached to it.

The original pump from non air car, photo's 447 and 453.

Casting number 1465323-2
Number on small plate attached 4N26

[57flw]

The replacement pump from the air con donor car is photo's 454 and 445.

The casting number is 1465323-4.
The number on the attached plate is 7-18.

It does not seem as though it would accomodate the long pipes.

My Questions are.

1. Are the pipes supposed to be there or are they some kind of mod.
2. Does it make any difference which pump I use?

The donor pump seems to be in better condition than the original.


Ken

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

I may be wrong, but the hard tubing looks more like a Plumber once owned the car, and definitely not automotive style.

Bruce.

[Coupe]

Bruce is on the right track. It looks like some decided to go with copper tubing under the intake manifold for the transmission cooling lines. Your second set of photos are correct for '57. The cooling lines should be rubber hoses running between the intake manifold and the valley cover. They are held in place by a couple of sheet metal brackets to keep them from touching the exhaust crossover in the intake.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

e

It looks like some decided to go with copper tubing under the intake manifold for the transmission cooling lines.

I think you meant to say Heater Hoses.

Bruce.

[Coupe]

In '57 the heater hoses go off the drivers side of the water pump and transmission cooling hoses run off the back under the manifold. The transmission cooler was a small tank mounted on the back of the transmission with hoses running to the water pump. In '58 the transmission cooling lines were run to radiator. I am not sure when the heater hoses were first routed under the manifold.  I know in '62 they go under the manifold.

[Coupe]

I should have clarified my response. I am familiar with the series 62 and have assumed the Fleetwood is similiar.

[Roger Zimmermann]

On both '56 I have, the rubber hose for the transmission is going under the intake manifold.

Roger

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

I love this site, and learning new things.

Thanks for educating me,

Bruce.

[57flw]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Bruce and Paul, I do agree with you on the plumbing work. I thought it looked a bit strange. I have just sent the pump that came out of the donor car to a bloke in Victoria that has done many of these.

Bruce, I don't know if you have dealt with him but it is John at JDM Industries in Elthan.

How do the hoses attach to the pump?
I would have expected a flair or something similar for the hose clamp to rest against. Check out the left hand union in photo 454.

Ken

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

G'day Ken,

That end looks like it has been cut off, but the photo isn't that clear.

It doesn't need much of a "knob" on the end to retain the hose, and I have seen fittings which are just plain pieces of pipe that have been screwed, or pressed, into housings.

And no, I haven't used JDM Industries before, but will keep the listing handy for the future.

Bruce.

[JKF]

That pipe may have been cut for some reason, I think I had flares on mine but I'm not 100% sure. But the pipe was short, that I remember!
Had a pain with re-soldering one of the other pipes (upper, to the transmission cooler?). Took a while until it was leak free, much easier with pump off the car!
Funny thing is that the only casting number visible on my pump is a 5 digit 50240. Well, maybe not that funny..
I've always believed the waterpump was correct for an A/C car but of course a lot can happen in 50 years.
Is your "conversion kit" early or late? (different pulleys etc.)

Keep posting, interesting thread to follow!
/JKF

[57flw]

JKF,

Not sure what you mean about early or late conversion kit.

My set for the air is a complete second hand air conditioner out of a donor car from Canada. I got everything that was needed to make the air work. If the part was needed to operate the aircon it was supplied to me in the big box.

Pleased to see you find what I am doing interesting. I am enjoying it also and am pleased with the help I have received.

I will have to wait until I receive the water pump back to see what I can do about connecting the trans cooler hose to that short pipe.

Ken

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

Ummmmm....... so the wheels are different on an A/C equipped car?

Bruce.

[57flw]

Very good pick up Bruce, especially for a Tasmanian.

No, I believe they are the same A/C or not HaHa.
That wheel gave me a spare that I was missing.

My car has a Carter AFB and the donor car had a Rochester 4Barrel.

Is the idle up valve the only thing that my Carter, non A/C, is missing and can I use the Carter with the idle up valve from the Rochester or should I overhaul the Rochester and use that.

I do know that the Carter Carby works. The Rochester quality is unknown.

I can provide pictures if you like.

Ken

[57flw]

Hey Guys.

Any comments regarding Carter or Rochester Carby re my last post.

I would prefer to keep the original  on the engine, ie. the Carter.
Can I use the idle up thing off the Rochester or do I need to source another one?

Ken

[57flw]

Lou, Thanks for your comments.

Here is a couple of photo's of the two Carbies I have.

The Carter is the original one off the engine and I know it works but does not have an idle up device. Photo 497.

The Rochester is off the donor car, with idle up but the condition is unknown.

I know I could recon the Rochester since it appears to be complete.

Where possible I want to keep the car as original as I can without going silly and adding heaps of money to the rebuild.

My question is.

Did the Fleetwood get produced with a choice of the two Carbies or was it just the Carter?


Ken

[Otto Skorzeny]

It wasn't exactly a "choice" per se. The customer didn't order a vehicle with a Carter or a Rochester, he just got whatever happened to be on the vehicle when it was delivered.

It seems odd today with modern standards of mass production but that was pretty common among carmakers back then. Most people don't realize that even today carmakers don't make most of the parts for their own cars but rather buy them from independent manufacturers who build them to the carmakers' specifications.

GM light truck frames, for example, are made by a huge Canadian company that no one's ever heard of called Magna.

Keep your GM car all GM? That's just a slogan that's as misleading today as it was when Madison Avenue thought it up.

[57flw]

Bit more of an update with the body work.

Just a small sneak look.

A couple of photos of the bonnet repair.

Ken