Tire rotation

[waterzap]

Had a bit of vibration on my 87 on the highway at 65. So of course my first thought is to just have the tires balanced to see if that works. Off to Discount Tire.

They look at the tires, which by the way are in excellent condition. No dry rot, bulges, even white walls still look nice. They said because tires are older than 6 yrs, they wont touch them. Tires were made in 2002. Also said there is some association, and no one will touch the tires.
Went to Subaru dealer of all places. They rotated and balanced the tires. Said they balance fine. Also no more vibration on highway. Easy fix.
Though finding someone in the future to balance slightly older tires might be a problem.
Is it that much of a risk for them to just balance my tires?

[Jon S]

"Someone" in an attempt to sell new tires convinced the Government that tires older than 6 years were "unsafe!"  That is a bunch of bunk; in fact tires made 40 years ago with REAL rubber do not get cracks or dry rot.  The Government and Auto Makers also reduced the level of ZDDP in the engine oil to cause flat tappet damage claiming the ZDDP caused pre-mature catalytic converter damage.  No different than the elimination of the lead valve lubricant from gas claiming it caused inner City children brain damage.  Our government watchdogs at work!

Your tires will be just fine!

[936CD69]

I work as a service advisor in a large independent garage. My 2003 Buick Century had about 28K last fall when I started feeling unusual vibration at speed. The tires, which were date coded July 2002, were original equipment. The outside looked flawless, but I decided to replace them anyway. 2 of the tires had internal splits exposing the steel belts. We see this all the time on tires that apparently are "good".

All tire manufacturers currently limit their warranty to five years from purchase OR six years from build date for a reason. Although we will "touch" older tires, the reason many shops won't is liability if something happens after they "touch" an older tire. IIRC, no tire built after 1941, perhaps before, is 100% "real rubber".

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

I've never heard of such a thing. Sounds like a miscommunication of some sort occurred somewhere at that place- OR they tried selling you a bill of goods. 

[R Schroeder]

I don't know if you missed the postings that Bruce and T.J. had about there old tires.
They do break down, and they do get to old to ride on.
Roy

Tj's posting. Bruce had one similar.

http://forums.cadillaclasalleclub.org/index.php?topic=121646.0

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

Absolutely true but as with everything- there are exceptions. The "6 year old" policy of that shop is a little ridiculuous- IMHO. I've had tires a lot older than that which were perfectly safe.

[Jon S]

I've never heard of such a thing. Sounds like a miscommunication of some sort occurred somewhere at that place- OR they tried selling you a bill of goods.

New York State inspection has the 6 year rule, but classic cars are exempted.  I only recently replaced a set of Uniroyals on the 1958 that were purchased in 1972, not for any problem except I wanted a wider whitewall.  My 1981 Corvette still rides on the original Goodyear Eagle GT's with 31.000 miles on them.  I have a 1973 Lincoln Coupe with Michelin X tires purchased in 1978.  No problems with any of them!  My 2004 Mustang GT on the 3rd set of Goodyear Eagles have surface cracks in them as did the last 2 sets.  What does that tell you?

[R Schroeder]

Tells me your playing with fire.............ha
Drive slow.
Roy

[Louis Smith]

I work as a service advisor in a large independent garage. My 2003 Buick Century had about 28K last fall when I started feeling unusual vibration at speed. The tires, which were date coded July 2002, were original equipment. The outside looked flawless, but I decided to replace them anyway. 2 of the tires had internal splits exposing the steel belts. We see this all the time on tires that apparently are "good".

All tire manufacturers currently limit their warranty to five years from purchase OR six years from build date for a reason. Although we will "touch" older tires, the reason many shops won't is liability if something happens after they "touch" an older tire. IIRC, no tire built after 1941, perhaps before, is 100% "real rubber".

Great post!  Sure 6 years might be on the low end of tire life, but is it worth taking the chance with your life?  I have had occasions where the tires appeared to be OK, but they were diagnosed with having internal damage.  Of course even the mattress manufacturers are telling us to change mattresses every 8 years, but other then a sore back in the morning, a old mattress don't pose any danger to our lives.

[R Schroeder]

What was it about 10 years ago when Firestone tires were blowing apart and killing people.
A lot of kids died when that happened. Very hard to control a car when the front tire blows out at high speed.
Watch the Indy 500..........ha
Roy

P.S. Yes I agree that 6 years is a little early to worry about new tires, but 15 years is taking a chance.

[Louis Smith]

What was it about 10 years ago when Firestone tires were blowing apart and killing people.
A lot of kids died when that happened. Very hard to control a car when the front tire blows out at high speed.
Watch the Indy 500..........ha
Roy

P.S. Yes I agree that 6 years is a little eary to worry about new tires, but 15 years is taking a chance.

All depends on annual mileage, and how much a individual values life. Besides brakes, tires are the most important part of a car for safety.

[Dave Shepherd]

Exposure to UV rays are the most damaging element to any tire, that is whay you see so many RV's with tire covers when stored outdoors.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

What is the story on compulsory Valve Replacement when changing tyres?   Or is there one?

When I had to have a couple of tyres replaced in Connecticut in 2008, the tyre bloke said he had to replace the Valves, and was adamant that it had to be done.

I said okay, but, he went to fit a rubber stemmed one.   I butted in, and said that I had to have the same as what was in the rim (Cadillac Eldorado FWD with the odd-shaped stem)   He said that he couldn't do that, but after I showed him that on the first revolution of the rim if on the front, the brake calliper would snip it right off, and the tyre would go flat, he agreed to use the old one, as they didn't have the proper replacements.

I said as the car would be leaving USA, and therefore I wouldn't hold them responsible.

The fella hadn't even seen one like this before. 

Bruce.

PS.   I had to instruct him and his fellow workers how to remove and replace the tyres as they had never done a rear-mounted rim before.   They had tried for two hours to try and remove the old tyre in the normal way before I got back to the shop.    Lucky for them, and me, the Cadillac Eldorado rims are so tough, they couldn't hurt it. 

[Louis Smith]

What is the story on compulsory Valve Replacement when changing tyres?   Or is there one?

When I had to have a couple of tyres replaced in Connecticut in 2008, the tyre bloke said he had to replace the Valves, and was adamant that it had to be done.

I said okay, but, he went to fit a rubber stemmed one.   I butted in, and said that I had to have the same as what was in the rim (Cadillac Eldorado FWD with the odd-shaped stem)   He said that he couldn't do that, but after I showed him that on the first revolution of the rim if on the front, the brake calliper would snip it right off, and the tyre would go flat, he agreed to use the old one, as they didn't have the proper replacements.

I said as the car would be leaving USA, and therefore I wouldn't hold them responsible.

The fella hadn't even seen one like this before. 

Bruce.

PS.   I had to instruct him and his fellow workers how to remove and replace the tyres as they had never done a rear-mounted rim before.   They had tried for two hours to try and remove the old tyre in the normal way before I got back to the shop.    Lucky for them, and me, the Cadillac Eldorado rims are so tough, they couldn't hurt it.

What year Eldorado.  I don't think there is any compulsory valve replacement in any of the states.  I think the shops use this as a way in increase their profits.  They also charge for getting rid of your old tires.

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

1972.   The same valve is used for all the Oldsmobile Toronados and Eldorados from the inception of the Front Wheel Drive until at least 1976.   Not sure when GM changed the valves to "normal" ones.

I get rid of my own tyres so that charge isn't a problem.

Bruce.

[Louis Smith]

It appears as though those valve stems are still available on ebay, and at a reasonable cost.  If my vehicle used those type of valve stems, I would be tempted to buy a set, "just in case".

http://www.ebay.com/sch/sis.html?_nkw=4+Tire+Car+Wheel+Valve+Stems+Toronado+Eldorado+TR417+&_itemId=220673451491

[waterzap]

Dont get me started on the valve stems. When I installed the front tires, they wanted to out on new valve stems. Told them it wont work, but of course they tried. First wheel they realised wont work. So they put the old ones back. I didnt even make it back home before I had a flat. Changing the tire in the rain, the jack slipped and I damaged one of the strips under the car. Fortunately I wasnt hurt. Took the wheel back the next day. On the end, inside the tire is a rubber piece. The rest of the valve stem is fine, but that piece disintigrated. They said, oh, we do have those pieces. So now the other wheel might still go flat at any time.
I did buy a set on ebay in the mean time. So when I replace the rear tires, would like to have the stems replaced. All 4 this time. But I dont really trust them. If they dont install the stems correctly, they will hit the brakes.
Still havent repaired that strip.

[cadillacmike68]

While no one is going to tell me i have to buy new tires at 6 yrars old, I rarely get tireslto last beyond 3 or 4 years because of all the miles we drive.

That said, the 1968 will get the least amount of use and the tires are almost 7 years old now with very little use over the past 6 of those years. I'll look at them inside and out when i get back. I need to get a set of 67-70 15x6 wheels anyway, because the 15x7s I have do not have enough of a lip to hold the wheel covers on all the way.

As to the Firestone tires blowing out 6-10 years ago, that was on Ford Explorers where ford lowered the "specified" tire pressure to 26PSI from 30 so that unstable vehicle would pass rollover tests. Firestone recommended a minimum of 30PSI.

I blame that entire fiasco 100% on ford.

[TJ Hopland]

The downsize E body in 79 went to a typical stem and hubcap mounting.  Also went to the smaller 4.75? bolt circle.

When ever I mess with tires on those cars I always check close to make sure the stems are clearing the calipers.  I tell shops that too and they look at me like I am crazy till they see the layout. 

[The Tassie Devil(le)]

Was visiting my Brother the other day, and he is off on another of his trips into the outback of Australia, into wherever the road or track takes them, and believe me, their Land Rover is set up for heavy stuff, and fording creeks and rivers that would totally destroy any of my cars.

Here is his story of his trip in 2006.
"Two tyres â€" both unused â€" one was fitted in mid-2000 and kept as the spare on the back of the vehicle, fully covered by a vinyl tyre cover.  The other was purchased in 2006 at Mt Isa because of a tyre failure on the journey.  These tyres were fitted to the rear of the vehicle.  Travelled from Mt Isa to Birdsville (all unsealed) then to Rockhampton via back roads (about 50% unsealed).  On arrival in Rockhampton these pictures were taken as a record of their deterioration. "

The total mileage was about 2000 Kilometres, and the original spare is on the right of the two pictured, and you can see the total degradation of the tread.

Imagine what would have happened if the tyre wasn't covered when not in use.   Suffice to say, the older of the two has been removed.

One good reason for rotating tyres so that the best can be obtained from these valuable pieces.

Bruce.  

PS.   No high speeds were travelled by him as he is one conservative driver.   I could imagine that if he had been travelling at anything over 100 Kph, even on good roads, the tyre would have disintegrated.