Basketcase Fleetwood Hearse

[hearse dude]

I recently purchased a 1985 4.1L Fleetwood Hearse on-line. I took it on good faith that the car was as described but low and behold plenty of undisclosed issues surfaced immediately. The car runs rough for a little while before cutting off. I changed the fuel filter and added fuel treatments in case it was bad fuel (car supposedly sat for two years in the funeral home garage before they traded it in to a local car lot).

Other issues that I cannot diagnose or correct:

1. Radiator fans run constantly whenever the key is in the on position (not run). I was under the assumption that they only ran if the car was on or at a certain temperature. I replaced the fan relays but they are still running constantly.

2. The fuel data center, climate control center, and radio all do not function (no lights or ability to turn on or off). I have checked every fuse on both sides under the dash and change those relays as well to no avail.

Any help that would point in a direction toward a cure would be greatly appreciated. THANKS!

[harvey b]

First thing I would do is drain as much gas as you can,that old stuff will harm your valves,the varnish could make them stick open.The fans are propably on because the car thinks the A/C is running,the fans are used to cool the condenser.the 2 problems are propably related that way,i have no experience with this type of caddy,but do some A/C work in my shop.The cars that have the auto climate controls are the hardest to repair as the control units are very troublesome,maybe look for a used one to try and see if it will work?.Some times just unhooking the battery can reset the computer?. Harvey

[hearse dude]

I've put a new battery in and I tried touching the negative post to the positive post to reset the computer, still nothing.

[Big Fins]

I'm not so sure that was a good idea there. Computers aren't too happy about reverse polarity. Even a touch could fry a diode board.

[hearse dude]

Once the negative post is removed from the battery there isn't a complete circuit so no juice is running through it anymore.

[Big Fins]

Not sure about something that old, but when my 2011 F150 acts up, I disconnect the battery for about 30 minutes and let the computer reset itself. Then all it has to do is re-learn my driving pattern. But it seems to work like a shut down and restart on a Windoze box.

It's all good again.

[Gene Beaird]

Where did this car come from?  I'm thinking you'll need a new ECU, at least, unless the electrical system is fried, from, I don't know, maybe flooding?  Hopefully a new ECU will get you back on the road.

[hearse dude]

Purchased it on-line from a dealership in south Florida. Of course he described it as meticulously maintained. Tomorrow I will pick up a used ECM and see if that fixes my issues. To be certain, do you think that the ECM is what's making it run rough and cut off, or the instrument panel issues, or both? Without the Fuel Data center and climate control working I can't even check to see what (if any) trouble codes the car is throwing. Also, I am beginning to suspect that it was flooded. I called the funeral home that last owned it (paperwork still in car) and they assured me that while they had it there was no problems or flood damage. I believe them because what do they have to gain by lying. They didn't sell me the car so I don't see any reason why they would be less than truthful. He said after they bought their new hearse this one sat in the garage for about two years and they sold it to the dealership last year.

[C.R. Patton II]

Hello Dione

Congratulations on your acquisition.

To make your relationship with this vehicle a success I would advise the following ASAP:
(1) Obtain all the Cadillac manuals for your model
(2) Join our national organization and a local region near your residence
(3) Join the Professional Car Society
(4) To avoid electrocution do not connect the prior owner(s) of your car to a lie detector.

[hearse dude]

Well I pulled the ECM this morning and the radio's clock started functioning (nothing else). After an exhaustive search I was able to find a re-manufactured ECM at O'Reilly's Auto Parts that I can pick up this evening. Hopefully that will solve some of my problems. I also ordered a 1985 Cadillac DeVille & FLEETWOOD factory GM shop repair manual.

[TJ Hopland]

This must be a transverse FWD model?

I recently dealt with a TBI car that had been sitting and there was crud in the injectors.

I'm wondering if the fan(s) issue is related to the climate control and related stuff being dead?  Maybe someone just bypassed all the non working usual control stuff and wired them direct to come on with the key?

Seems odd that what you have done so far got part of the radio partially working.   I wonder if you have bad ground or grounds?   Hopefully the manual will help you find and check those.    Was 85 a year with a separate electrical troubleshooting book?  Those go into more detail than the regular manuals on individual systems. 

[hearse dude]

Thank you for all the help so far. Replacing the BCM solved the fan problem and the instrument problems (albeit, the radio still doesn't come on, just lights up). However, the rough running persists as well as the cutting off. Also, I neglected to mention before, the ride leveling pump never cuts off either. I'm assuming that a hose is loose or broken somewhere. Last (for now) the fuel gauge is reading "0" even after me pouring 5 gallons into the tank.

[TJ Hopland]

The weak link in the level ride in that era is the combo level sensor / control module connected with a link to the rear axle.   It reads the level of the axle then decides if you need more or less air.  If you need more it signals a relay under the dash to run the compressor to put more air in the system.   If its too high it signals a solenoid on the compressor to bleed off air.   Sounds like you have bigger problems at the moment, I would just unplug the electrical connectors from the compressor to prevent further damage and come back to it later.   The shocks themselves could also be leaking at this age.   

Are you getting a check engine light?  Does the light work?  You should see it light when you first turn the key on.   

[hearse dude]

The check engine light comes on briefly when you start the car but it doesn't stay on. The service AC light has come on and went back off intermittently. It is blowing cool air but not cold. That is probably an easy fix and not a concern right now. The Service Soon light was on before the new ECM went in but it appears to have gone off now. I was able to retrieve some trouble codes but didn't fully understand how to decipher them or move through the systems at the time. I have since printed out all of that info and will take a closer look at them again tomorrow.

[hearse dude]

Don't know if I can upload video but this is what it is doing...Aside from the engine stalling you can hear the leveling pump in the background just running away. I search for an electrical connection to it but was unable to find it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxFBWoaWuWw&feature=youtu.be

[Big Fins]

I feel your frustration, but that's loping like a severe vacuum leak would cause.

[hearse dude]

I'm about to replace the exhaust system and then just take it to the Chevy dealership a few blocks away and see if they can make heads or tails of it.

[hearse dude]

Drained all of the gas out of it today and replaced the EGR valve. It is still not able to find the proper idle but it sounds a lot better. Tomorrow we will change the TBI gasket and see if that fixes the problem. It definitely appears to be a vacuum leak but we cannot locate it definitively. Depending on what happens tomorrow I will replace the exhaust system and then have a professional look at it. If it is reasonably priced to fix then I will proceed, otherwise I will look for a buyer and sell it AS-IS with everything disclosed that I know is wrong with it and try to recoup some of my money back.

I did have a quick question, the gas that we drained out of the hearse was a bright yellow/orange. Is this normal? When I fill my lawn mower the gas is translucent. How much of an effect do you guys think this gas has had on my issues?

[TJ Hopland]

Bad gas is not going to help it run good.   Get some good gas in there and see if it helps.   If the gas was that nasty you may want to change the filter.

Also was thinking back to my throttle body experiences and remember that if the base throttle and timing settings were not properly set they would run pretty crappy.  To set those the computer had to be put in specific modes.  Just guessing or thinking you are improving things just seems to confuse the computer.

A also remember the distributors just coming loose on 4100's for some reason.

[hearse dude]

Thanks TJ. Well I put 5 gallons of fresh gas in after we had drained the tank and it is definitely running better than before but it still isn't right. It ran a good 10 minutes prior to me buttoning everything up for the night but the idle was still considerably low. That's the longest it has ran since I have had it.

I figured the computer was confused also, that is why I said I will try a new gasket tomorrow and if that doesn't do the trick then I will leave it to the folks at the local GM dealership to see if they can fix it for under a grand. That is the most I willing to sink into it at this point.

So I do I safely dispose of 18 gallons of orange fuel?