sold a CT6 this week

[59-in-pieces]

Jumping in again.

Somebody is missing the point if you need to Google a car to get the info one might need to decern one make or model designation from another - let alone to buy.

There was a time when you knew it was a Cadillac; and it really didn't matter if it was this or that model or even what year - IT WAS A CADILLAC.

And apart from that, you knew that person was SOMEBODY.

No matter what it is, right down to finding your girlfriend or wife - LOOKS CATCH YOUR EYE - AND PURSUIT FOLLOWS. (i'll get PC letters on this)

In the more recent years, there has been little to catch the eye about Cadillac design.

There is something very profound about "BUILD IT AND THEY WILL COME" - since the competing manufacturers pricing tracks along with each other, why not distinguish yourself with distinctive Cadillac design.

DUMP - "Dare Greatly" for DESIGN GREATLY.

Have fun,
Steve B.

[30326]

Rename the Ciel to Eldorado and start producing it. It will sell and it will bring back life to the brand Cadillac!

[Big Apple Caddy]

Somebody is missing the point if you need to Google a car to get the info one might need to decern one make or model designation from another - let alone to buy.

There was a time when you knew it was a Cadillac; and it really didn't matter if it was this or that model or even what year - IT WAS A CADILLAC.

My post about searching online was not to be able to discern one make or model from another but rather to be made aware of what models existed (in response to Scot's comment re: livery driver).

A lot of people CAN recognize today's Cadillacs and CAN tell one model from another.  Some can't but as I've stated here before, comments about cars looking too much alike have been around for a very long time.

And apart from that, you knew that person was SOMEBODY.

This point I agree with but it's not just a Cadillac issue as it is also true for other luxury brands.  Pricing combined with longer term financing and/or aggressive lease deals have made it easier and easier for buyers to get into a new Cadillac, Lincoln, Mercedes, BMW, etc.

[wrefakis]

sorry fans I service the livery driver industry and every time I drive an XTS and Camry in the same day I am amazed at how little difference there is on the road
Cadillac once owned the commercial and livery industry, heck Carey limousine was named Carey Cadillac limousine

the XTS is not excellent in any way, and costs a fortune to keep on the road

remember when Cadillac was king of the division there was little competition

last week same day,16 XTS 39k miles 15 Lincoln MKT and 16 Camry drove them all, lots of road noise, harsh ride nothing like a luxury ride, when town car died so did luxury livery service fleet
and yes, none of these new units rides like my 310k mile 05 town car

remember when Cadillac was king there was no sedan that could compare with a Fleetwood, and up to 70 they were very good running cars as well

[59-in-pieces]

A. Stromstedt,
I agree with you about the Ciel.
I would also offer up 2 more, which would cause me to turn over my hard earned shekles:

The Elmiraj and The V-16 (wouldn't even need to have a V-16, the looks alone are compelling).

Oh, and perhaps more to your point about names - not a one of the concept cars has indecipherable or uniquely distinguishable letters or numbers.

Have fun,
Steve B.

[Scot Minesinger]

wrefakis,

I have driven a late model Camry, and what a total POS.  It drove terrible in my driveway!  Have never driven an XTS or equivalent Lincoln.  Guess I will keep driving my 2007 CVPI, which really is great, and should last forever.  When CT6 is V-8 powered will not be able to resist considering it though.  I like that car, but have not driven or even rode in it yet.

[wrefakis]

camry is pos trouble is xts drives very much the same and needs more service to stay on road

[Walter Youshock]

Did I just hear correctly that the Cary has "safety automatic high beams"?

ANOTHER Cadillac convenience that was thrown out 30 years ago...

The Avalon looks better all the time...  Wonder if they have automatic parking brake releases, too...

[Eric DeVirgilis CLC# 8621]

Walter...Intellibeam (auto headlamp dimming) was a new option beginning in 2006 model year. It actually works much better than the Guidematic.

[dochawk]

For me a Car has to stir up something inside me when I see it AND when I drive it.

We had our annual Cadillac Through the Years event yesterday.

Near the name plaza, we had a row of, give or take,

• 1946 Convertible
• 1949 Limousine
• 2017 CT6
• 1917 Touring
• 1946 Sedan
• 1930s

My reaction was that the 2017 made it look like someone's butler brought his own car . . .

Anyway, at least CT6 and CT4 let us see at a glance how many cylinders are missing . . . . choosing between a 400hp, or even 500hp six, and a 300hp eight is a no-brainer . . .

hawk

[Big Apple Caddy]

Oh, and perhaps more to your point about names - not a one of the concept cars has indecipherable or uniquely distinguishable letters or numbers.

As much as I prefer model names like DeVille, Fleetwood, Seville, etc for nostalgic reasons, I wouldn't consider Cadillac's new (or even outgoing ATS, CTS, etc) model names indecipherable.   As far as the new ones, CT refers to cars and XT refers to crossovers, and the number (e.g., 5 in XT5) refers to the position/level in the lineup.   It's pretty straightforward.

Luxury import brands also use alphanumeric model names and many are seeing record sales here.  Alphanumeric names should easily be able to work for Cadillac as well.

[Big Apple Caddy]

Anyway, at least CT6 and CT4 let us see at a glance how many cylinders are missing . . . .

CT4?  The numbers in the new Cadillac model names have nothing to do with cylinder count.

[denniscaddy]

I tend to agree about the model names (CTS, CT6, etc.).

I've had an emerald green 2017 CT6 (Premium Luxury) for two months now.  I've owned a lot of Cadillacs, and this is the best, by far, in my opinion.  Wonderful ride and handling, powerful, agile, excellent fit and finish, endless technology.  VERY quiet.  The only thing I don't like about it is that I haven't yet learned all the features.

Consumer Reports gave it a 95 score on the road test.  Almost no other cars have matched that.

How it will age is unknown.  We won't know that for some time.  But for now, I'm loving it.

And I love my 41 Fleetwood, too.

Dennis

[64\/54Cadillacking]

I am sorry, but the CT6 is just a horrible name for a luxury car, let alone a Cadillac.

The problem that Cadillac is having with itself these days is not just it's image, but it's overall identity for it's customers to know what model means what.

My dad, for instance, is old school and owns a 2002 Town Car, he wants something new and will be in the market for a luxury car soon, I told him about the CT6 and he was like "What the heck is that"?

I had to show a picture of it, and he really wasn't all that impressed with it's styling.

Knowing him, he wont buy the CT6 because the name itself is terrible. He wants a car that is well known and comfortable. I told him although the CT6 is nice, it probably still wont ride as nice as his Town Car. The Lexus LS460 is probably the closest thing in terms of ride quality that he is searching for. Not to mention the Lexus overall fit and finish, quality of materials, performance, and reliability destroys the Town Car by a landslide.

I drove the new Lincoln Continental Black label edition at a car show late last year, and I was fascinated and impressed by the car, especially it's interior quality and styling. But the car rode rough and choppy although it was very very quiet inside. If I could afford a $60,000-70,000 luxury car, the damn thing better ride perfectly and I don't want to feel any pot holes or rough stuff below me, and the Continental failed at doing just that. I blame the 20-inch wheels with rubber band tires, but still, engineers should have been able to figure out a way to make the ride smoother since big rim vehicles are a norm these days.

I don't think any modern luxury car with typical strut set up will ever ride as nice as a Cadillac from the 60's and 70's, or even the RWD Cads from the 80's and 90's.

I am currently leasing a 16 Altima for my job, and even though it is a new car and drives well for the most part and has great performance, the ride is really rough on bad streets and course pavement. The road noise is loud on the freeway especially on concrete.

Road noise is low or non-existent under 35mph, but around 50mph the noise goes up big time! I researched the car just out of curiosity, and Nissan added extra sound insulation on the 2016 models vs the prior years, and the car is still loud.

So after driving this car all day long, and getting back into my 94 Fleetwood, it's like a night and day difference! The Cadillac rides so much better, is more comfortable, and is quieter too! The Altima is like driving a hollow piece of metal, that absorbs noises through its body as the structure tries to limit it's forces, and jolts you over rough streets and pot holes badly, while the Cadillac being fully-framed just drives composed and rides much differently and is not as affected as much by our rough streets.

The Fleetwood deflects the noises and impacts, rather than absorbing them, the benefits of having a heavy framed car with SLA suspension vs Struts. Driving over the same stretch of streets in my city was really noticeable. The Fleetwood road noise doesn't change a whole lot while driving on different pavements and quality of streets, but in the Altima, you definitely feel and hear the differences, and it's not good.

The closest car that rides as nice, if not better than my Fleetwood and is super quiet, is the Chrysler 300 that I rented a few years ago. The 300 is so underrated and undervalued that it's sad. You get a V8, RWD, long wheelbase, great tech features, masculine good styling for a reasonable price. Sure the interior quality isn't that great, and the car isn't considered "true" luxury, but you get a decent amount of room inside, and the car rides better than any mid-size or most other luxury cars out there for half of the price.

[Scot Minesinger]

64Caddylackie and others on name,

I'm with you all and even most CT6 owners, not thinking the name is that great.  However, you wrote that your Dad (64 Caddylackie) did not like the styling and that is the main reason he is not driving over to the Cadillac dealership.  Other CT6 owners still bought it despite the name.  The name is not the barrier to purchasing the car.  It could be a marketing issue.  If Cadillac sold a RWD convertible with a back seat that actually accommodated adults comfortably with a V-8, or a 5 passenger large sedan RWD V-8 those would be must haves on my buy list no matter the name.

I started the post about why is this CT6 Cadillac unknown to many perspective purchasers, such as the limo driver and etc., and it could be the name.  However, if was not in CLC might not have heard of it either.

 

[D.Smith]

The marketing problem with the CT6 (besides the stupid name) is that people don't know how big it is unless it is parked next to the smaller models.    A picture of the car on a billboard doesn't convey size.  They see the CT6 name and doesn't mean anything to them.    The name may designate the platform but not to the average person.   Put that car on a billboard with the name FLEETWOOD above it and the phrase "It's big and it's back" and that will motivate people to go to a dealer and see what its all about.

[WTL]

Dave that is a good point, the styling doesn't convey the size of the car in print.  That is a separate issue from actual size, a 1970s Deville looks long even in photographs.  CT6 looks pretty much like a CTS.  Maybe if you get a shot that is directly in profile you can tell, otherwise good luck. 

I suspect the problem is the marketing of CT6, not that most people wont buy a CT6 once they become aware of it's existence.

I would have no clue that it exists if not for keeping a close eye on Cadillac. 

I agree that Fleetwood and Eldorado should be used again, at least on the American market.  Just try that, and then see if Seville and Deville need to be brought back. 

[Big Apple Caddy]

To specifically blame the CT6 name itself for lack of familiarity with the model is a stretch.  The alphanumeric XT5 model name was also new and that model is seeing very good sales for Cadillac.

Any time a company introduces a new model and/or changes its model names (whatever they may be), there is going to be a period of unfamiliarity especially among non-auto enthusiasts, those not in the market or those who are very passive shoppers.  In today's digital world, there is little excuse not to know or be able to easily find out what models are available as well as related details if one has an interest, is a serious/active shopper, and has even average internet skills.

If Mercedes-Benz buyers can figure out that brand's new models, new model names/rebranding, etc. and allow it to enjoy record year after record year as the top selling luxury brand in the U.S., Cadillac buyers should also be able to figure out and become aware of Cadillac's models and names.  It's not rocket science.

Cadillac's sales issues right now are more about desirability than familiarity.  The segment where Cadillac used to shine brightly (large sedans) just isn't nearly as in demand with buyers in general these days.  If that segment was as popular as it used to be, the CT6 would be selling much better regardless of name.

[WTL]

As you repeatedly note, the XT5 is a utilitarian vehicle that people popularly desire. I'm willing to bet not many people can identify it by its name either, but if they want a crossover and go to a dealership with the wife and kids and they walk the lot, it has as good a chance as any of going home with them.

Maybe we can build one area of consensus here? - a new Fleetwood/CT8/renamed CT6...would be a specialty vehicle.  Can we agree on that?

It's purpose isn't to be the sales flagship, but rather an option for admirers of Cadillac - fans of what it has traditionally been.  A moral flagship maybe. As such, it does not necessarily need to be built in huge numbers.  But I would argue it does need to be built. 

Such a car would need to be set apart from the rest of the lineup.  Escalade too is set apart.  Why not Fleetwood?  What is it really hurting to just give in?  lol, the trim letters arent that expensive! (Or maybe they are, considering the Escala...)

[Walter Youshock]

NO DESIRE FOR BIG SEDANS???  REALLY?  Have you actually read the responses posted here??? 

So if you don't want a shopping cart, you can get an over - glorified station wagon or monster truck...  that's it.