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1932 Cadillac V16 scale model

Started by Roger Zimmermann, July 12, 2019, 01:40:19 PM

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Roger Zimmermann

#740
The frame for the windshield is a very large casting in bronze or aluminum; I don't know exactly. Anyway, I cannot replicate that method but I have to silver solder many parts small or large to get a similar result.
The picture depicts my actual result; this is the point I don't exactly know how I can continue...There will be a solution on day, but not for the moment!

631 Windshield posts.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Stefan Bartelski

This is really awesome workmanship, unbelievable. Although I cannot help but wonder, with the modern technology available, would this not be easier made using 3D printed parts?
Stefan Bartelski

admin@forums.cadillaclasalle.club
470-253-4725

Roger Zimmermann

Quote from: Stefan Bartelski (CLC Webmaster) on May 31, 2024, 10:39:53 AMThis is really awesome workmanship, unbelievable. Although I cannot help but wonder, with the modern technology available, would this not be easier made using 3D printed parts?
Thanks Stefan! To make parts using a 3D printer, a good scan from the part(s) to be reproduced must be available. I don't have that, because I should have access to a real car amnd the scaning machine! This method would in any case be more accurate than my gessing...
Then, a philosophical question: is 3D printing still modeling? The sole skill needed is to be a computer's freak and have the printer. I don't have that skill nor the machines...
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

bctexas

Quote from: Stefan Bartelski (CLC Webmaster) on May 31, 2024, 10:39:53 AMThis is really awesome workmanship, unbelievable. Although I cannot help but wonder, with the modern technology available, would this not be easier made using 3D printed parts?

The word "art" comes to mind.  Scanning an item and using a 3D printer to replicate it is not "art".

Roger is a true artist in his chosen field.  That a computer and 3D printer would be "faster" or more "accurate" is irrelevant.  The 3D printed version will never have the charm or intrinsic value (and I'm not just talking about $ here) of a lovingly hand crafted model.

We are truly privileged to have Roger sharing the journey with us and I look forward to every installment!
1965 CDV
1970 SDV

cadman59

I prefer the skills from Roger...
Feiko Kuiper - Netherlands (Europe)

1959 Cadillac Series SixtyTwo 6-Window Sedan
https://instagram.com/feikokuiper

Stefan Bartelski

Quote from: Roger Zimmermann on May 31, 2024, 11:45:52 AMThanks Stefan! To make parts using a 3D printer, a good scan from the part(s) to be reproduced must be available. I don't have that, because I should have access to a real car amnd the scaning machine! This method would in any case be more accurate than my gessing...
Then, a philosophical question: is 3D printing still modeling? The sole skill needed is to be a computer's freak and have the printer. I don't have that skill nor the machines...
Roger, as many have posted above, there is a special value in the hand crafting. However, scanning is not usually used in 3D modeling. Instead, a 3D CAD pro0gram is used to 'draw' (or design) the required parts. You probably have a plan of the vehicle; it just needs to get converted into a 3d drawing.
Stefan
Stefan Bartelski

admin@forums.cadillaclasalle.club
470-253-4725

Big Fins

I'll go so far as to say that Roger is a craftsman with his hands, not a keyboard.

Physical craftsman are a dying breed.
Current:
1976 Eldorado Convertible in Crystal Blue Fire Mist with white interior and top. (Misty Blue)

Past and much missed:
1977 Brougham de Elegance
1976 Eldorado Convertible
1972 Fleetwood Brougham
1971 Sedan de Ville
1970 de Ville Convertible
1969 Fleetwood Brougham
1969 Sedan de Ville
1959 Sedan deVille

dadscad

I agree with Big Fins. Roger is a true craftsman. He has a mental vision for what he wants to do and he uses his skills and the available material to create his vision. It's fascinating to see how he accomplishes building the final parts.

To say the least, it is a dying skill in today's plug and play world.
Enjoy The Ride,
David Thomas CLC #14765
1963 Coupe deVille

Roger Zimmermann

Quote from: Stefan Bartelski (CLC Webmaster) on May 31, 2024, 02:24:13 PMYou probably have a plan of the vehicle; it just needs to get converted into a 3d drawing.

Well, Stefan, this is the first issue: no plan is available. I asked Cadillac heritage center, Paul Ayres if the CLC has something, Internet...there is just nothing. The sole person who had a side drawing from a 1932 AWP just refuses to make a copy.
There are some drawing existing for 1930, however, 1932/33 was a bad period for cars manufacturers; hard to blame them...

Thanks to the other people for their comments manual work v/s computer/3D printer!
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

billyoung

I personally have a problem with people who hoard stuff and information that is of an historical nature or just want to charge a fortune to share it. At this late date who cares, just share with others of a like interest and passion for the good of all. I do hope someone comes through to assist with drawings , photos dimensions or something. Your work is amazing.
Age 70, Living in Gods waiting room ( Florida ) Owned over 40 Old Cadillac's from 1955's to 1990 Brougham's. Currently own a 1968 Cadillac DeVille Convertible and a 1992 Cadillac 5.7 Brougham.

Roger Zimmermann

Thanks Bill!
Fortunately, I have plenty pictures. Dimensions are another matter: for the same object, two people will come with different measures! As I wrote earlier, there are two people who can share some dimensions: Johan Boltendal and Paul Ayres. I don't want to abuse with requests, therefore I try to be careful.
Drawings: with the exception I mentioned somewhere, they are just not existing, as far as I know.
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Roger Zimmermann

The transition between the vertical and horizontal surfaces at the windshield gave me a hard time since the wood's buck. It was not better when I added the molding which is in front of the windshield: compared to the pictures I have, what I did is not quite looking the same as on them. Why? Lack of accurate dimensions, and the possibility to see the real shape myself. Various stencils made with cardboard would help too, but for that the physical access to a body is needed. When I did the Mark II, I had the luck to have access to a parts car with which I could do all kind of stencils without risking to damage the finish!
Anyway, I did some progress at the windshield frame by adding a connection between both posts. To be sure that the distance between both will stay the same, I soldered a half band at each post and then I adjusted the connection and secured it with screws. When the frame's top will be done, the lower band can be trimmed.

632 Cowl.jpg633 Cowl and windshield frame.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Roger Zimmermann

Thanks to Johan, I got the precise length of the posts, so I could shorten them and add the upper part from the windshield. Johan sent also pictures showing the light curve of that element.
The bottom frame is to be made, as well as the sides. Those will give me some trouble because they have a nice detail. I don't know yet how I will realize that...

644 Windshield frame.jpgWindshield 6.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Roger Zimmermann

The windshield frame is almost ready. Two difficulties did my life harder: the décor at the corner from the windshield's post and the frame itself was not flat, but the base has a slight radius towards the rear. With a multitude of brass bits those difficulties could be overcome.
Still missing: the pods for the wipers and one for the rear view mirror. Those 3 parts will also be silver soldered on the assembly. 
I also have to ad two pins which are used to locate the convertible top when closed.
After that, a good detailing and polishing should make a decent windshield frame.

645 Almost ready.jpg646 interesting detail.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Barry M Wheeler #2189

Roger, I don't think any of us would dare challenge your workmanship nor think that you didn't do your utmost to "get it right." In glancing at the original, if you get it 75% or even less, close to the multiple curves on that corner of the full sized car, you can be proud of the result. Hang in there. BW
Barry M. Wheeler #2189


1981 Cadillac Seville
1991 Cadillac Seville

Roger Zimmermann

Thanks Barry! I realized later that the second picture is approximatively at the same perspective than the original one! For the moment, I'm not at 75%; I hope that the finishing touches will bring it closer...
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Lexi

Very nice work Roger, as usual. Clay/Lexi

Roger Zimmermann

#757
Thanks Clay!
With the addition of the pods for the wipers and rear view mirror, the windshield frame is ready. However, there will be still some elements to ad like the inner moldings. I will have the choice to make them in real wood or painted brass. If the original parts are attached with screws; mines will be glued because of past negative experience.
I will now do the ventilation door from the cowl.

647 Windshield frame.jpg648 Windshield frame.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Roger Zimmermann

Even if the alignment from the vent door is far from perfect (it will be corrected in due time), the system operates more or less the same as the original one: a rod is rotating one hinge to open or close the vent; three or four positions can be set.
The rod is not yet done because its position will be dictated when the dash is done.
When completely open that vent could act as an aero-brake!

649 vent door.jpg650 vent door open.jpg651 mechanism.jpg
1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101

Roger Zimmermann

The auxiliary firewall is indeed not a complicated part. With a large die, the flange could be bend, making a one-piece part. As such a die would be rather large, I opted for a multi-parts affair, with the upper and side flanges soft soldered to the base. I could use again the die I did for the lower section from the main firewall.
The original part is attached to the main firewall with several nuts located very near from the flange. I simplified this methos by using just a few nuts. Contrary to the original vehicle, I will not ad insulation material between both parts!
The next step: I will solder to the assembly the brackets to attach the dashboard. Both brackets should be the last parts requiring soldering.
Without destructive heat, I will then use plastic filler to correct some irregularities.

652 secondary firewall.jpg

1956 Sedan de Ville (sold)
1956 Eldorado Biarritz
1957 Eldorado Brougham (sold)
1972 Coupe de Ville
2011 DTS
CLCMRC benefactor #101