Restoring a 1956 Cadillac Series 62 Coupe in Germany

[harascho]

it's been a while and the Caddy makes slow but continious progress.  Now I need an advice regarding the Hydramatic. I cleaned it thoroughly, although it was looking as it was rebuilt somewhere not too long ago. Quite clean, no debris. I decided to give it a go, knowing that a major overhaul might be needed in the future.
The only thing is I got a bad leak where the manual shaft enters the housing, see pic.  Can I change those O-rings from underneath with the Tranny still in the car? I know it's fun removing the valve manifold with oil dripping on you... but I am ready for it...

What do you think? Any advice?

cheers

Harald

[Roger Zimmermann]

It can be done, but it's not easy. Even when the transmission is on its back, like on that picture, there is one snap ring at the shift control lever which is difficult to remove. I can imagine that, when the transmission is installed on the car it will be more complicated. If you succeed, the largest seal can be replaced.
A small pin at the throttle control shaft must be removed to replace the smaller seal.
Good luck!

[harascho]

Hi Roger,

do you have a pic that shows the location of the snap ring and pin? Is there any information on the replacement seals?

Thx a lot

cheers
Harald

[Roger Zimmermann]

If you can wait one or two days, I can do a picture, I have a '56 transmission from Germany in work.
At you place, I would order the set from Dave Edwards http://www.autotran.us/ You will then get both O-rings and the small pin.

[harascho]

Roger, that would be perfect. Then I could decide which way to proceed.

Thanks a lot

cheers

Harald

[Roger Zimmermann]

Here is the promised picture. To get at the seals, you will have to remove both levers. Don't worry about their position, they are indexed.
Good luck!

[harascho]

So Roger, both seals are accessible from outside the case?

cheers

Harald

[Roger Zimmermann]

Yes! If you can remove pin and steel ring...

[harascho]

Hi Roger,

that seal is done, not too big of a problem using a hoist..
Harald

[harascho]

Ok here are some pics. The Caddy is almost finished and ready to visit the German TÃœV for it's inspection. After that is done it will be registered as historical vehicle.
I had to built a few tools to get a rough alignment which should be fine until I find a shop willing to do the front end alignment. Hard task because those guys are just following computer instructions without any knowledge what they actually do.

We will see

cheers

harald

[harascho]

And guys pls don't bother about the chrome air cleaner.. the original oil bath cleaner is almost ready to be installed..;-)

I have a parts problem with an overhaul kit of the steering box. The output shaft has some side play and I found a kit at Cadillac Ltd. But they seem to be temporarily out of business.. no one answeres mails or calls ??

Any othe sources of a complete kit?

cheers
Harald

[winger888]

Good luck with the TÃœV Harald.

[PHIL WHYTE CLC 14192]

Did you get a replacement gas tank? I have a spare 1954 one, which may be the same. I'm in England. Phil

[harascho]

Thx Phil for the offer, I bought a new one and later bought a set of parts including a used but good gas tank.. so I'm fine

[PHIL WHYTE CLC 14192]

Great, the car looks really good. I've got a 54 Coupe DeVille.

[harascho]

Good Morning Gents,

a few more issues and questions along the way..;-)

First of all I tried rebuilt the washer pump... wasn't easy on my nerves and still doesn't work. I took a lot of pics during the dismanteling process but that was a good year ago and now the assembly seems to cause a headache. Lucky me I have two pumps I can play with. Yesterday I assembled the second one... testing will be later the day. Does anybody have some additional pics of the internal parts of the pump and the correct installation? There are not a lot of ways to do it wrong but you never know.

Second issue is when I checked VAC of the newly rebuilt engine the readings are quite low. When playing with the timing ( a little more advanced than the manual states..), the bypass screw and the mixture screws I have a wonderful running engine that runs very smooth, almost no valvetrain noise, no hesitation on acceleration and a steady idle.... only issue VAC max is 15 in. That seems a little low for me. I am not able to detect any VAC leaks... only thing left to do is a compression check.
What should I expect for a good VAC reading? Is 15 really too low?

thx for helping
cheers
Harald

[harascho]

What a lovely day that was..... I spent my whole day with two issues: washer pump and wiper escutcheon...sealing the washer fluid against the escutcheon
It was almost half a day until I had a nice spray pattern on the windshield.... not what you might guess... I used a big syringe.. not the washer pump.
It turned out tha a 6mm length of a particular hose size did the trick very well.
Then encouraged by that success I started on the washer pumps... I got two of them and one overhaul kit from Fusick.. I hoped I might end with one working pump...
Normally I am not the one giving up early, but those pumps soon got the best of me...
The mess ended with one of the pistons shooting out of the housing and destroying itsself on the workshop wall. I couldn't laugh at all but I guess any bystander would have liked the scene..
Then I digged out my Pneumativac and used it as a VAC source. That thing pulls an easy 22 in and that was a big help. Assembly of the two halfes of the Pump cylinder was quite easy once the VAC sucked the piston in against the spring.
I was able to get at least a part function of one pump... that one with the old seals....The pump with the seals from the overhaul kit still doesn't do anything.
What I learned is once the piston is moving against the spring pressure and its bottom part seals enough to suck in water your good to go. So far only one of my pumps does that and after a while water output is decreasing....Ok there still the Sunday to sort that one out.

cheers

Harald

[J. Gomez]

Harald,

Oh yes the vacuum washer pump and motor, Cadillac disgrace for not going electric on both, second to the vacuum pump placement at the oil pump. 

I’ve mess with two sets of full washer pumps and frankly neither got me the results I was hoping for, there are way too many pieces to get them working correctly.    I have several pictures of them during disassemble but won’t be able to post them here due to space limitation. If you want/need them just shoot me a PM with your email.

The two pieces the top metal cover and the middle one are all for the vacuum controls. The top one controls the operation to and from the washer push button and the other side is for the co-ordinator. There are valves that open and close to get vacuum to and from the outlets.

The top (bottom) and the middle (bottom) pieces are a combination for vacuum and the washer fluid. The washer fluid is just one small valve between them that would either opens or closes to flow the fluid out to the sprayers. The vacuum side allows vacuum to flow up to the top sections for the controls via two valves and to fill the large canister inside the bottle with vacuum to pull the dual plunger up (where the large spring in place).

The small plunger with a small spring inside the large spring is just a switch when the dual plunger is pull the small spring would close the valve to stop the vacuum (you can see this valve inside the large canister). If vacuum drops slightly the large spring compression would drop the plunger and the valve would open up again to allow more vacuum to fill the canister. This sequence repeats several time since it is not a perfect seal.   

When you press the washer button to spray the fluid, it would release the vacuum held at the hose from the pump and at the large canister, this forces the compressed large spring to push the plunger down to force the fluid out. Once you release the washer button the sequences repeats itself to fill the unit with vacuum for the next cycle of washer fluid.

Now the funny thing is the amount of fluid is very small just what the smaller canister (where the outlet hose is connected) can hold, so there is a valve to hold any fluid to back flush into the glass bottle.   

After all of this I would need to take a couple of Tylenols. 

I have one unit which I dismantle and will convert to electric, I’m leaving the two canisters inside (removing the guts inside) the bottle and adding an electric pump on the lid. I’ve also changed the wiper motor to electric less hassle to deal with all the vacuum lines this way.

There is no need for the vacuum pump at the oil pump with all these things out of the picture. That line from it on the side of the block was closed and I’ve added a plate between the oil pump and the vacuum pump.

PS Your vacuum reading of 15Hg look to be good for this engine, if I recall 15-17Hg is what would one expect during idle.

Good luck..!

[Lexi]

I had my stock '56 engine rebuilt and installed about a year ago. When back from the shop it ran at idle at 17" vacuum. After properly breaking it in, it jumped to almost 19", and is steady. Seems I read years ago in a GM publication that 15" would be at the absolute low end, as Jose said, (can't recall if at idle or in drive with brake on though). Prior to rebuild, my other '56 engine ran at 18" at idle. My rebuilt '56 CDV engine in the '70s ran at between 21" - 22". Go figure. Back in the day, the mechanic who rebuilt that engine said 18" - 22" with the needle being steady, was normal for a healthy V8 with no vacuum leaks. As Jose said, (and that GM article if I recall correctly), 15" may still be acceptable unless you are living at an odd elevation. If you are checking it in drive with E brake on it will read slightly lower. All my readings were taken in park at idle at around 550 RPM (slight higher than OEM specs suggested). My car will not idle smooth at that number 15 though, or at the recommended 400 - 450 rpms, nor did any of my other '56s. If you break in your engine properly vacuum should increase a bit. Mine went up about 1 & 3/4". Depending on how you have driven your car and the miles since rebuild-you may be beyond that point to increase it. As I am sure Jose will agree, there can be variations in this but if your car does remain at the low end, but otherwise runs well and the needle remains more or less steady, I would think you are OK. Clay/Lexi

[harascho]

To the VAC readings, I have to say that the engine had no time to break in. I just had the CAM broke in and made a few runs round the corner to sort out the brakes. Everything is as fresh as it could be. Driven up to date for less than 5 mls..;-)

Today, after I had my second cup of coffee, I will address the Trico washer pump again...drives me crazy that thing and I'm not willing to give up... not yet..

By the way when I test the internal plunger if it seasl enough to suck in water when it moves upward.. it rarely does. The system seems to seal itsself once it is full of water. Then, and only then, a downward movement pushes water out and an upward movement sucks water in. And this is with new seals from a seal kit. I did some tests with O-rings instead of the bottom seal on the plunger, that work actually a lot better?

cheers
Harald