1950s 1955 Eldorado Driver's Door Adjustment - Not Fully Closing

[Lockhouse]

Hi,

So, the driver's door on my '55 Eldorado is engaging the safety lock but not closing fully. I've adjusted the lock plate on the pillar as far out as it will go but the door refuses to close properly. Take a look at the video here:

You can see the photos of the general door position. I'd appreciate people's thoughts. Obviously, the panel fit isn't too bad but where can I get that extra 1/8 of an inch to get the door to lock properly if the lock plate is fully extended?

Thanks for taking the time to look.

Best regards,

Andy

[Cadman-iac]

  Andy,
I'm no expert on how to adjust these doors, but from what I can see in your picture, it appears that part of the catch, or striker assembly is either broken off or very worn. That could be a good bit of the problem right there.
Another thing is the roller on the end of the latch that is supposed to roll inside the striker. I have a couple off this 55 that have been worn flat from not being greased so they'll roll. And if the flat spot is in just the right place, it gives a little more clearance for the latch to move in the striker, and won't hold the door in alignment.
And I think that the 56 2 door models were the last ones to use this type of latch and striker design. The 4-door hardtop in 56 has the newer design with a star-wheel type of latch in the doors and a completely different striker assembly.
Only the 2 door models got this hokey design. The good news is that from 55 back to whenever, (not sure when this design began), but 55 back all models used it, 2, or 4 door. So there are parts out there, but look closely at them, of the 6 I have, only 2 were any good.

Does the door close and line up well if you push it in, and how hard do you have to push? A little bit is acceptable, but if it's hard to push it into lining up, you may have to adjust the door hinges to get it to close properly.
It lines up with the body ok though? If it does, any additional adjustments on the hinges might mess that up.
Who you really need to talk to is a body man and see what he has to say.

Rick

[Daryl Chesterman]

I suspect that the problem is with the latch mechanism on the door.  You can check this theory by opening the door and using your hand to slowly raise up the round part of the latch to the safety position (first click), then proceed farther to see if it will lock into the fully raised position (second click).  If it doesn't, that means you will need to investigate why it won't latch in the fully raised position.  Below is a picture courtesy of eBay, of what is said to be a latch for a 1955 Cadillac, but it doesn't say Eldorado.

Link deleted per request by Richard Cook

This picture is upside down from the way it is in the door—meaning the wedge you see in the top of the picture should be on the bottom and the round end of the latch mechanism should be on the top.  The picture, if correct for your car, shows how the mechanism operates.  You can click on the thumbnail pictures to the left of the main picture to see some different views of the latch.

Daryl Chesterman

[Cadman-iac]

  Daryl is correct about the latch, if it's not moving into the secondary position, it leaves the roller in a lower position, which in that striker is farther outward than the fully closed position would put it. Now the reason it may not be moving to the secondary latch position is that the roller bearing, (yes, it has a bearing on the end so it moves easily through the striker), is stuck due to dirt or old dried-up grease. If this condition does not get fixed, eventually it will wear a flat spot on the roller and then the latch is pretty much junk. The latch is assembled with rivets, which makes it difficult to rebuild or swap individual parts between latches. I've had to do some work on the latches for my coupe, but I'd have to dig them out now to be able to say exactly what I did now. That old memory thing again.
  I remember that the strikers have a stainless piece that is riveted in place that the roller rides over. It's near the top of the striker on the outboard side, where the most pressure is from the roller when the door is closed. I didn't see it in your picture, and that will also add more clearance to the roller track and allow the door to not close as far as it should.
 When I got my car and the 55 parts car, I had no idea that they had a bearing on the end of the latch lever. Mine were pretty dirty and didn't rotate, not until I had taken them out to clean everything up, then I realized they had bearings and made sure I got them working again.
 
   Rick

[Lockhouse]

Hi Rick, Daryl,

Thanks as ever for the replies. Some great suggestions as to what to check.

When I hold the door in place, the panel line up is great - shame to mess around with the hinges at this stage before exhausting other options. As you say - I might speak to a body guy.

I attach a picture of the latch which looks very used and original. It is going into the second position when I move it manually. Then it drops slightly.

I wonder if the roller is too worn?

I will check my part numbers and see if that eBay one is the same. They did change them frequently for 55/56.

Best regards,

Andy

[Lockhouse]

p.s. the lock assembly part number is 466 4966 which was also used in Buicks.

[Cadman-iac]

 If the door alignment is good, then you don't need or want to mess with any hinge adjustments.  That will only make things worse. I will check my coupe latches after I figure out which box they're in, and see what I can figure out from here.
 I don't remember what vehicle I had seen this issue with, but I recall seeing the mounting holes on one that had cracks around the holes from stress, either from slamming or misalignment at some point. I didn't see any in your picture, but if memory serves, there's 3 mounting screws for the latch assembly, and the picture only shows 2 of them.
  I'll check my latch for how much it will rise before it latches into the secondary position and if it drops any afterward. That may be normal, I can't recall. But I seem to remember that there's a rotating wheel or a rocking lever with a catch finger on it in the latch mechanism that might explain why it drops after catching the second position. I've gotta see it to know for sure though. I'll let you know tomorrow.

 Rick

[Cadman-iac]

  Yes, there was some interchangeability between the car lines. I also recall that on some of the latches on that alignment wedge, there was a flat piece welded to the flat rearward face of it, but its purpose escapes me. And I think it's just a 56 thing, the 55 didn't use it, of vice versa. Again,  gotta see it to remember it clearly.
 
 Rick

[walt chomosh #23510]

Lockhouse,
  I bought my 55CDV 25 yrs or so ago. A friend of mine owned a restoration shop and also had a 55Eldo at the time. I called him in regards to my driver's door alignment and he responded by informing me that both he and his body man had spent a whole week attempted to get a door right, only to fail and not show any improvement! I myself, have walked out to my driver's door over and over again telling my self "I'm going to get it this time", only to fail!(I rebushed my hinges along the way) I've moved on but am still discouraged that I simply could NOT adjust my door!....walt...tulsa,ok 

[Cadman-iac]

  I'm still trying to get out and look for the latches, but I do remember that even though all models used that style of latch and striker for 55, there is a difference between the 2 and 4 door latches, but the strikers are the same. On the latch, and the outside door handle, in a 2 door they sit higher in the door. If you compare where the handle is in relation to the belt line of the car, you can easily see the difference between them. And since they fit in the door differently, they will not interchange.
The more I think about this the more I remember about it. I think I was desperate to get my driver's side latch working and I ended up swapping a piece from a 4 door latch to mine, I think. I've done work on other latches for an El Camino and I may be confusing the two, because it's been years since I've worked on either one of those. And I didn't take pictures of what I had done, so I can't refer to one for verification.
Give me another hour or so and I hope to have some answers for you on this.

Rick

[Lockhouse]

I've taken the plunge and bought the LH latch on eBay. It looks like new and they say it's been tested but as ever it's a gamble.

I've got a new piece of chrome door trim to fit too, so can do both at the same time when I take off the door arm rest and door card.

I will report back as and when.

A

[Cadman-iac]

  That's good too. I just located mine, I had put down the wrong box number on my inventory sheet, so I had to go box by box until I found them.  The latches do have a "drop" in the lever after they catch the second position. I believe it's so that the lever release mechanism will be able to clear the catch lever after closing the door. I did get the two vehicles mixed up in my memory, I have not swapped any latch pieces on the Cadillac ones. About the only thing that can be swapped easily are some of the springs, everything else is riveted in place with big rivets,which I doubt you could replace without special tools.
 But here's pictures of both my left and right latches, and the left and right strikers.

[Cadman-iac]

  Daryl,
 I hate to ask this, but your link to the latch for sale is so long it's extending the texts way out and with just a phone it's very difficult to read without losing my place. Since Andy has bought the part,could you possibly delete the link and hopefully the text width will return to a more normal size?
 Thank you very much for understanding, I hope this isn't too much to ask.

 Sincerely,  Rick

[Lockhouse]

Daryl,
 I hate to ask this, but your link to the latch for sale is so long it's extending the texts way out and with just a phone it's very difficult to read without losing my place. Since Andy has bought the part,could you possibly delete the link and hopefully the text width will return to a more normal size?
 Thank you very much for understanding, I hope this isn't too much to ask.

 Sincerely,  Rick

I thought it was my browser!

[Cadman-iac]

 It might be,  but I've noticed in other threads where a really long link is attached it tends to do this. I'm just guessing that's the cause, no proof, but if he deletes it and it solves the issue, we'll know for sure.  And if it doesn't, then he can reattach the link. I just don't know any other way to find out what causes this.

 Rick

[Daryl Chesterman]

Richard, I deleted the link and it shortened up the width of the post.  I don't know why it did that, because when I posted it the link was 5 lines and confined to the width of the window    I can't repost the link because the listing has been removed due to Andrew purchasing it.

Daryl Chesterman

[Cadman-iac]

Hey, it worked. Thanks Daryl. I don't like to ask that sort of thing, on a thread I'm only looking at it doesn't matter, but here I've been trying to participate and trying to see what I'm typing is difficult at best when the screen spreads like that.
 Thank you for doing that, at least we now know what makes it happen for sure.

Rick

[Cadman-iac]

  Something else it did was it put my pictures that usually end up at the end of a post and added them to the next post. Explain that one!
The pictures of the latches should have the same thing but smaller at the bottom of that post with whatever ID it assigns to each. They never showed in the first one, but showed up in the 3rd post that followed.

Rick

[Cadman-iac]

Andy,

I can see in your picture of the striker, that it's definitely different than what was on my 55, and my 56. On mine, the lower part that receives the wedge part of the latch and acts as a guide of sorts, has a thicker bottom lip to it with a track that is cut into it for that flat plate on the back of the wedge.
Yours is just a thin lip that is totally flat, no groove like my55 or 56.
I'm beginning to think that the Eldorado has a lot of special parts on it that aren't found on the other models.
Without a side by side comparison, it's hard to say if you can use a regular 55 striker.
The reason I mentioned all this is because I can see yours is worn pretty badly at the top where the latch roller makes contact. You can see the wear markings in the metal itself. So you might want to look for a replacement for that as well.
On a side note, your picture is cut off right at the edge of the striker, you can't see the whole thing, but you can still see the wear in it.

Rick

[Lockhouse]

Hi Rick,

Thanks again for the detailed photos - great reference.

I've looked for striker plates by part number and they all seem to vary slightly - some have a deeper "notch", some have a shorter riveted piece. They all have the same part number which is strange. I'll replace the latch first as that is evidently worn more.

My car had a frame off around 25 or 30 years ago and I don't have any details of who did it so I don't know what parts are original and what are new (I can generally make a good guess). Also assuming the car was done by someone who knew what they were doing (I think it was) then they would know what they could substitute, as per my little episode with my wipers demonstrates.

Best regards,

Andy