Hello to NC folks, and help needed once again

[Chris Braun]

First of all, wanted to let those who knew, know that I made it to Wilmington from Chicago just fine with the 60 sedan.  Well, almost just fine anyway.   Towed a u-haul trailer, did great up to Raleigh area.  Then started to overheat.  Added water, let it cool down, kept going.

About halfway between Raleigh and Wilmington, started to get warm again.  So.. pulled into a gas station.  Checked radiator, low again.  Added fluid again. (remember these dont have an overflow tank, and its hot, so it could be spilling to the road).  Checked oil, looked a little low, so added a quart.  After 1000 plus miles, I didnt think being down a quart is so bad.  SO.. kept going.

Then about 5 or 6 miles outside of Wilmington, I start seeing white smoke behind me, on the right side.  Upon slowing down, its coming from under the hood too.  Plus as I slow down, its running awful rough.  

Made it to the new appartment, on what seemed like a wing and a prayer.  

Drove it a week later to a local guy who supposedly is in the know on old cars.  He does a lot of work for most of the members of a local car club.  Told him everything.  

Hes so far made sure the carb is in tune.  Checked the timing.  Checked the spark plugs, wires, distributor.  One plug was fouled w/ oil.  Checked distributor timing, was ok.  Pulled off the heads, to check headgaskets, as this was my fear, but no problems.  NO water in oil, no oil in water, etc.  

With replacement of spark plug, and a better carb tuning, the engine is running slightly smoother, but still pumping out white smoke as soon as it warms up.  

Any suggestions?

[Michael Stamps 19507]

Im not an expert but I play one on the internet.  Id say you are getting blow by on the rings of that piston.

Stampie

[Bruce Reynolds # 18992]

Chris,

White smoke is Auto Transmission Fluid, so you might check the Vacuum Modulator in the Trans.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le),
60 CDV

Further, the water level in the Radiator should always be around 1" below the top of the radiator filling hole as expansion takes place when it gets hot.

If you fill it up to the top, it will always "overflow" until it finds its correct level.   Usually, just above the top of the cooling fins.

[Porter 21919]

Bruce,

What kind of smoke do you get if the master cylinder is leaking brake fluid into the power brake vacuum line at the carby ?

Porter

[Bruce Reynolds # 18992]

Porter,

I dont know what the colour of that smoke would be.   Never had it happen to me.

Maybe Mike might know.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le), who doesnt know everything,
60 CDV

[Lynn 10923]

White smoke can also be antifreeze getting into the cylinders. Were the heads and the deck surface of the block checked for cracks when it was apart? And seeing as how the radiator kept getting low...?

This happened to me once just like this several years ago. The engine seemed fine when it was cold, and as it warmed up, white smoke would start pouring out the tailpipe. It turned out to be a cracked head.

Lynn

[Chris Braun]

Stampie, Wouldnt blowby show up on a compression test though??

[Chris Braun]

What u be saying about transmission fluid makes some sense.  Where would the smoke be coming from then?  Out of the breather and downdraft tube, or from the exhaust.  Whats strange is, there is no weird smoke coming out of the exhaust.  

Oh, and as for the radiator finding its level.  Yeah thats always been the way.  I totally agree.  I guess it was just finding a level a little lower than Im used to.  

As to the other fella who replied about checking the deck for cracks and all, I thought about that already.  The mechanic did a chemical test on the radiator fluid and the oil, and found none of the opposite where it didnt belong.  

Chris,

White smoke is Auto Transmission Fluid, so you might check the Vacuum Modulator in the Trans.

Bruce,
The Tassie Devil(le),
60 CDV

Further, the water level in the Radiator should always be around 1" below the top of the radiator filling hole as expansion takes place when it gets hot.

If you fill it up to the top, it will always "overflow" until it finds its correct level.   Usually, just above the top of the cooling fins.

[Chris Braun]

Ok, whats with the brake fluid leaking into the carb from the vacuum tube.  Anybody ever had that happen?  I dont think thats happening, but I know I need a new master cylinder as the pedal slowly pushes to the floor at a stop again.  Its not leaking much, takes a few weeks to go down enough to add fluid.  But it is leaking somewhere.  

But what Im returning to is that there is no excess smoke coming from the exhaust pipes.  Only from the breather tube and the downdraft tube.  My thoughts are that if there was something strange getting into the carb, itd cause smoke at the exhaust pipes.

[Chris Braun]

Nope, cant be getting into the oil.  Did a chemical test on oil and radiator fluid, and niether is getting where it shouldnt be.  Plus there aint no smoke coming from the exhaust, only from the breather and the downdraft tube.

[Porter 21919]

If you have no external leaks you maybe be burning brake fluid through the vacuum line, because the master cylinder is shot.

[wm Link]

brake fluid makes  white smoke too

[Lynn 10923]

It doesnt have to be getting into the oil. It can be getting into the cylinders and creating white smoke without getting into the oil.

Lynn

[denise 20352]

   But...did it quit overheating when you filled it up with coolant?  Brake fluid, transmission fluid, etc. in the intake is not going to cause the engine to overheat.

   I havent tried using chemical tests, although the idea sounds interesting.  Has anyone done a cooling system pressure test?

   Excessive smoke out of the breather tube indicates blowby.  The condition may or may not show up on a compression test...if its using oil and its not leaking out anywhere, it may be time to consider an overhaul.

   An oil-fouled spark plug could indicate a leaky valve seal or guide, or, with an older engine that is using some oil, could just mean that the plug isnt firing.  A new plug might be in order, and if the wires are old, they should be replaced.

-denise

[denise 20352]

   Thats what I was wondering, about the chemical test, if it could detect a leak between a water jacket and combustion chamber.

-denise

[Rhino 21150]

Has anyone tried smelling the smoke? Antifreeze is sickly sweet, oil, tranny and brake fluid smell like their respective dipsticks, or cover. All fluids are different colors, so pressure wash the engine bay and the trans at the coin-op car wash and look for fresh leaks when the engine dries. Use a small, easily bribed child, or ramps, to get at the trans. The child may also have a functional nose whereas you do not, just have him/her compare smells. If you dont have a child handy, look for a Mom at Wal-Mart who has several with her and rent one.

[George]

Anything that gets into the combustion chamber will also exit from the exhaust, regardless of what fluid it is. You say you have checked the oil for water and got a negative result.
  Any foreign matter in the engine will make its way into the oil. the obvious conclusion is that whatever is causing the problem is oil based, so not obvious to the eye, like water or antifreeze.
   Blowby thruogh the heads is caused usually by worn piston rings. Some substance could have been making its way into the engine for some time and burning away, hence no excessive exhaust smoke. but if you have developed a problem with a single piston while on a long journey, that cylinder will then act differently and blow any foreign matter back out through the valves.
Transmission fluid, or brake fluid, is a good bet. Hot unburned gasoline can also burn white.
  I bet the problem has been with you for a while, un-noticed. Then the problem that has developed in the cylinder with the fouled plug has enhanced it.
  Check the fouled plug , if it has fouled again, that cylinder is faulty and has exposed the other problem.
  Change the oil and filter.
  Disconnect the power brake hose, then any other hoses to the carb. plug the connections. Run the engine till it gets hot and check for the smoke.
  Reconnect the hoses one at a time to check for the source of the smoke.

[Porter 21919]

George,

Good diagnostic advice.

Definitely something wrong with that one cylinder with the fouled plug, that would be rings or valve seals if Im not mistaken. A hotter plug for that one cylinder might be acceptable , just for a stopgap measure.

[JIM CLC # 15000]

06-02-05
Chris, take a q-tip and swipe the inside of the vacuum hoses.
It can/could be brake-fluid or transmission fluid. Use a new q-tip on each hose. If it is dry, nothing is being sucked into the engine.
You said that you towed a trailer, but you didnt say how big it was, nor have you said that your car is a 60 SERIES OR a 1960. If it is a 1960, natly it has a "auto-xmission. But if it is a 60 SERIES it could have a "manual" trans.
Good Luck, Jim

[Chris Braun]

Wow, quite a lot of activity since I last checked.  As for the smoke, its still only coming from the breather and downdraft tube.  and it doesnt smell sweet.  So Im thinking its not radiator fluid.  

To answer the question about the overheating.  It ceased to be hot when I added water.  But eventually got warm again.  It never did "overheat" per se,  but it normally runs at a little over 1/4 on the temp guage, and it got over 1/2 a couple times.  To me thats overheating.  I didnt let it get any hotter, by stopping the car, and adding fluid.  

The mechanic where the car is at right now, has done a leakdown test, and determined that cylinder #3 is definetely leaking much faster than any of the other cylinders.  I need to talk to the shop that did the original rebuild 2+ years ago now.  I think that #3 was one of the cylinders that was damaged and was sleeved.  Perhaps the sleeve wasnt strong enough, or has been damaged again by a bad piston, or bad rings.  Ill be back on here Monday with more info, and more questions Im sure.