Paint Care for Black Lacquer Single Stage Paint

[Michael Petti]

My black 60 CDV looks great except when the sun shows all the micro scratches. Some say glaze is the answer, if so what brand? Others say Rubbing compound. I have seen a product by Chemical Guys called Black Light Glaze which promises the moon. I am curious how members of this forum maintain and/or fix their black single stage paint. I am trying to go the least aggressive as possible since I can not replace the lacquer paint. Ill appreciate any and all suggestions.

[J. Skelly]

Rubbing compound is too abrasive for this purpose.  It should be used only on finishes that are heavily oxidized or have a lot of orange peel.  Even polishing compound paste is too abrasive for micro scratches.

I'll let others on this forum recommend the liquid compound/cleaner that works best for them.

[Michael Petti]

Thanks for the response. Takes two options off the table. Was leary of them. I might add, if whatever I do only gets 70% of it, that's ok. I want to preserve the paint so less aggressive is better in my book.

[Lexi]

Thanks for the response. Takes two options off the table. Was leary of them. I might add, if whatever I do only gets 70% of it, that's ok. I want to preserve the paint so less aggressive is better in my book.

I am inclined to agree with both you and Jim. Defintely a situation where less is more as less is least destructive. I now use Mother's CMX Ceramic Spray based coating, a nano-technology based product, to hide scratches on my car. Unlike other products, I believe the ceramic product does more to alter the wave lengths of light to better integrate themselves so as to make the finish appear more "wet", hence uniform. Similar to why a wet road at night looks more uniformly dark with less of the imperfections showing as more of the reflected light is scattered off in other directions. Just my .02 cents worth. Just apply with a micro fibre cloth then wipe off when dry. Do not apply in direct sunlight as way too tough to remove swirl marks and streaks. Similar to using a detailer product. Attached are 3 shots of my old lacquer finish, before and after application of this product. The first shot shows the results during application. When I first applied this product I did a cut and buff and hope will not have to do that again. Probably too optimistic on that last point, but best to apply on the best possible finish you have. I apply it now twice a year. This is a less invasive means of making your car look better while protecting the original finish. There is now a far better product available that while more than double the cost, my son-in-law says provides a net gain over the Mother's ceramic coat. Will report back later if I remember to ask him what the new stuff is. Clay/Lexi

[35-709]

"There is now a far better product available that while more than double the cost, my son-in-law says provides a net gain over the Mother's ceramic coat. Will report back later if I remember to ask him what the new stuff is. Clay/Lexi"

Graphene? 

AI Overview from Google

...
Graphene and ceramic coatings are both used to protect vehicle paint and can have similar gloss, hydrophobicity, and application methods. However, graphene coatings are generally considered to be superior to ceramic coatings in several ways:
Durability
Graphene coatings can last for more than five years, while ceramic coatings typically last two to five years.
Strength
Graphene coatings are stronger and harder than ceramic coatings, with a reported increase in yield strength of up to 34%.
Thermal conductivity
Graphene coatings have a thermal conductivity of around 5300–5400 W/mK, which is much higher than ceramic coatings and allows for faster heat transfer.
Corrosion resistance
Graphene coatings are highly resistant to corrosion due to their atomic tightness and uniformity, which prevents aggressive substances from penetrating.
Water resistance
Graphene coatings are less likely to develop water spots than ceramic coatings because water forms beads on the surface instead of evaporating, and the beads then slide off smoothly.
Electrical conductivity
Graphene coatings have higher electrical conductivity than ceramic coatings.
Environmental friendliness
Graphene coatings are considered to be more environmentally friendly than ceramic coatings.

[Moody]

Lacquer paint needs to breath, even at 60 years old. My recommendation would be pure carnuba wax with no additives. Most of these new waxes are formulated for new urethane finishes. I've seen many great lacquer paint jobs go flat because of poor finishing products back when lacquer was the standard in auto restoration.

[David Greenburg]

Before doing anything abrasive, try doing the Meguiars #7 "soak" It's an old school formula that "feeds" the single-stage lacquer, and brings back a lot of the shine. You can find the specifics on one of the dedicated detailing forums like Autogeek. But basically you slather it on very liberally, like 1 1/2 to 2 bottles on a large car, and leave it overnight before rubbing it off. Then top it with whatever wax or ceramic you like.

[Jeff Rosansky CLC #28373]

That has been an issue with our 55. It was very faded, and the paint was thin and even worn theu in a few places.
I found a clay bar (lightly) really cleaned things up. Then several coats of carnuba wax. All done by hand.
It looks great, but loses it's shine after a while.
I'm still looking for more longer lasting results.

[Moody]

David, #7 is good stuff. Many people don't like it because it's not easy to wipe off, which is a good thing!

Jeff, (what a beautiful car!), the best thing is keep the carnuba on there. Longer lasting is more than likely full of other things that are not lacquer friendly. It's a good workout to wax a Cadillac.

If you ask a paint manufacturer what to use, they will most likely recommend nothing, or carnuba. (As long as they don't have their own line of paint care products.)
Most of these better than ever paint care products are not all that. Carnuba was the standard 60 years ago, long before modern paints came along, probably best to stick to that, IMO.

[David Greenburg]

Meguiars #7 has apparently been around since 1922 or something like that. One of the detailing sites has a video that talks about it and shows a collection of bottles and how they've evolved over the years.

I think a lot of the new products are pretty great, but they are designed for modern paint, not single stage lacquer. My philosophy is to stay with old school stuff for that paint. I use more modern (but perhaps old school to some people) on my newer cars and older cars with modern paint. I have not yet ventured into the world or ceramics. It seems like the pros love that stuff, but they are usually dealing with new cars with new paint, and trying to be as quick/efficient as possible, in contrast to preparing an old car with lacquer paint for a car show. 

[Michael Petti]

Yesterday I decided to take a shot with some Torque ceramic polish I had on hand. Rubbed it in by hand in small areas as suggested  by some of you and the color cam out beautiful. Unfortunately in direct sun the scratches are still there. Maybe covered 20% of them, so I still need something better.

[Moody]

A light polish, but not a compound, may be in order. Black shows everything which makes it difficult.

[dn010]

I'd suggest trying Meguiars M9 swirl remover. The 2.0 version is not as good as the original but will still work. I have been using the Meguiars line of product for years and highly recommend them.

[Lexi]

Yesterday I decided to take a shot with some Torque ceramic polish I had on hand. Rubbed it in by hand in small areas as suggested  by some of you and the color cam out beautiful. Unfortunately in direct sun the scratches are still there. Maybe covered 20% of them, so I still need something better.

As far as I know, Ceramic coatings don't remove scratches but can hide some of them, kinda like having a built in "polarizing-like" filter built into your paint, sort of. Some unwanted reflections are blocked, leaving a fantastic finish. That is why you should apply it on the best possible finish to start with. As David suggested a "polish" first may be in order. An experienced paint guy might even suggest a compound first, or as I did, do a cut and buff which will remove a number of them. A good paint guy should be able to advise after seeing your car's finish. Afterwards, you can re-apply the finish of your choice and hopefully be able to maintain it without ever having to aggessively deal with the imperfections in your original paint. I seem to recall some of the professional ceramic coating may last a couple of years. The Mother's product I wrote about above, does not appear to last that long. Got to ask my son-in-law about the new product he recommended. Attached image shows the CMX I was mentioning. The other shows Meguiars 7, which I think is the product David talked about. Yes, I saw that same video where the history and evolution of this product was discussed. I did try that a year or so back, but was not impressed with the results. Did not seem to be worth the effort. Seems others have had more luck with it. Clay/Lexi

[David Greenburg]

The Meguiars #7 treatment seems to be better at "feeding" the paint and bringing out shine than removing swirls or scratches. There are certainly some swirls and scratches in my paint if you go looking for them, but I am very nervous about getting too aggressive with original paint that is thin in places, so at least for now I just consider it part of the patina of 63 year old original paint. If I could find an old school paint guy I trusted, I might consider more corrective action.

[Moody]

If it were mine, I would not hesitate to sand and buff very carefully. But I started out in paint work in the 70s, so I have experience with lacquer. With the nice high grits of sandpaper we have today, such as 3000 up to 8000 grit and finer, the surface would be almost polished before any hand rubbing had to take place. Always a big question is, has the car ever been repainted? And is it indeed lacquer? Not enamel? Old Centari enamel can buff up very well and is almost indistinguishable from lacquer. 

[Lexi]

"There is now a far better product available that while more than double the cost, my son-in-law says provides a net gain over the Mother's ceramic coat. Will report back later if I remember to ask him what the new stuff is. Clay/Lexi"

Graphene? 

AI Overview from Google

...
Graphene and ceramic coatings are both used to protect vehicle paint and can have similar gloss, hydrophobicity, and application methods. However, graphene coatings are generally considered to be superior to ceramic coatings in several ways:
Durability
Graphene coatings can last for more than five years, while ceramic coatings typically last two to five years.
Strength
Graphene coatings are stronger and harder than ceramic coatings, with a reported increase in yield strength of up to 34%.
Thermal conductivity
Graphene coatings have a thermal conductivity of around 5300–5400 W/mK, which is much higher than ceramic coatings and allows for faster heat transfer.
Corrosion resistance
Graphene coatings are highly resistant to corrosion due to their atomic tightness and uniformity, which prevents aggressive substances from penetrating.
Water resistance
Graphene coatings are less likely to develop water spots than ceramic coatings because water forms beads on the surface instead of evaporating, and the beads then slide off smoothly.
Electrical conductivity
Graphene coatings have higher electrical conductivity than ceramic coatings.
Environmental friendliness
Graphene coatings are considered to be more environmentally friendly than ceramic coatings.

You are right. It was graphene that he recommended now over ceramic, I imagine for the reasons you stated. Will have to try it out. Thanks for posting. Clay/Lexi

[Michael Petti]

If it were mine, I would not hesitate to sand and buff very carefully. But I started out in paint work in the 70s, so I have experience with lacquer. With the nice high grits of sandpaper we have today, such as 3000 up to 8000 grit and finer, the surface would be almost polished before any hand rubbing had to take place. Always a big question is, has the car ever been repainted? And is it indeed lacquer? Not enamel? Old Centari enamel can buff up very well and is almost indistinguishable from lacquer. 

The car has been repainted long before I got it. I had a body guy who took a dent out my quarter panel tell me it was lacquer because of the way it ground off. I thought it was acrylic enamel myself, but who am I to argue? I am definitely going to research the graphene products. I hope they can be applied very easily by hand or with an orbital polisher because after my experience with hand applying the ceramic, the arthritis in my 78 year old hands limits my hand waxing with carnauba wax, to Match Box or Hot Wheels cars. Maybe a Smart Car but certainly not our Cadillacs.

[Julien Abrahams]

Are there any alternatives to Meguiars nr 7?. I have two cars with their original single stage paint that I want to preserve. However,here in the Netherlands the nr 7 is simply not available. I contacted Meguiars HQ and they confirmed that they do not longer ship the nr 7 to Europe.... :-(.

[Moody]

Can you order #7 through other sources? I'm not sure about the exact additives, but I know it's good for paint.